outside of track measurement
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Topic author - Posts: 7
- Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2022 8:23 pm
- First Name: Timothy
- Last Name: Keith-Lucas
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 depot truck
- Location: Carrabelle, FL
outside of track measurement
Newbie here. Just purchased a 1924 "depot truck." I'm trying to reinforce the ramp and floor of a covered trailer to bring our prize back to it's new home, and don't know the outside and inside of the track. The previous owner is not available. The track itself is 56 inches, but how wide are the tires on either side of that? I want to make loading slots - a board on the inside and the outside of the tires on the trailer ramp and floor. Can someone help me with that measurement? Thanks a bunch.
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- Posts: 6411
- Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2021 10:08 pm
- First Name: Pat
- Last Name: McNallen
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926-7 roadster
- Location: Graham, Texas
- MTFCA Number: 51486
- Board Member Since: 2021
Re: outside of track measurement
Is the vehicle on a Model T chassis or a 1 ton Model TT?
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- Posts: 527
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 2:51 pm
- First Name: Terry & Sharon
- Last Name: Miller
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1920 Center Door, 1920 TTWood cab Farm Truck with cable dump grain bed, 1920 TT C-Cab with express bed, 1927 Wood body Dairy Delivery truck
- Location: Westminster, CO
- MTFCA Number: 32583
- Board Member Since: 2017
Re: outside of track measurement
Tim,
Welcome to the club. ONE word of CAUTION: Check the HEIGHT.
Most enclosed trailers are not tall enough for a model T with a cab. So, accurately check the height of your depot hack and the height of the DOOR JAMB to ensure you will be able to get the truck in and out without damage. Been there, Done that. Our trucks, one TT and one Pie wagon on a regular chassis (same as a car) will need an 8 foot door opening as they are over 7 feet tall.
Congratulations on your new truck and Good Luck,
Terry
Welcome to the club. ONE word of CAUTION: Check the HEIGHT.
Most enclosed trailers are not tall enough for a model T with a cab. So, accurately check the height of your depot hack and the height of the DOOR JAMB to ensure you will be able to get the truck in and out without damage. Been there, Done that. Our trucks, one TT and one Pie wagon on a regular chassis (same as a car) will need an 8 foot door opening as they are over 7 feet tall.
Congratulations on your new truck and Good Luck,
Terry
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- First Name: Dennis
- Last Name: Prince
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1)24 touring 2)25 TT's 1)26 roadster 2)26 tourings 1) 26coupe 1)27 funster 1)28 A pick up
- Location: Madras Oregon
- MTFCA Number: 22802
- Board Member Since: 1999
Re: outside of track measurement
What size tires does it have?
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Topic author - Posts: 7
- Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2022 8:23 pm
- First Name: Timothy
- Last Name: Keith-Lucas
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 depot truck
- Location: Carrabelle, FL
Re: outside of track measurement
Thank you, Terry. I've got a lot to learn here. I'm used to antique motorcycles, but not cars. It's a regular chassis, and is open with a simple box body and no doors, but the height of the windshield may be an issue. The previous owner tells me that it is removable. The trailer is 72" wide with the door very nearly full width. I'll certainly take a full tool set with us when we go get it.
This is a ordinary 6' by 12' covered trailer. I figure on adding tracks to both the ramp and the floor as structural support as well as a way to confine the car, and an electric winch in front to back it into place. I'm figuring the weight to be between 1400 and 1500 pounds.
Any thoughts on that track width, or have my plans got a fatal flaw?
This is a ordinary 6' by 12' covered trailer. I figure on adding tracks to both the ramp and the floor as structural support as well as a way to confine the car, and an electric winch in front to back it into place. I'm figuring the weight to be between 1400 and 1500 pounds.
Any thoughts on that track width, or have my plans got a fatal flaw?
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- First Name: Scott
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- Board Member Since: 2005
Re: outside of track measurement
The car is around 5'-9" across the front hubcaps and around 11'-6" long, with height around 7'. I don't see it going into a 6x12 enclosed trailer...
Scott Conger
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
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- Posts: 6411
- Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2021 10:08 pm
- First Name: Pat
- Last Name: McNallen
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926-7 roadster
- Location: Graham, Texas
- MTFCA Number: 51486
- Board Member Since: 2021
Re: outside of track measurement
I think you'd do much better to rent or borrow an adequate trailer. Fenders will extend outward beyond the tires. PS: Caution! Do not winch a Model T by attaching to the center of the front axle, and do not tie a Model T down at the center of the front axle. Do not jack a Model T up by the center of the front axle. Doing so risks bending the axle, and perhaps other damage.
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- Posts: 527
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 2:51 pm
- First Name: Terry & Sharon
- Last Name: Miller
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1920 Center Door, 1920 TTWood cab Farm Truck with cable dump grain bed, 1920 TT C-Cab with express bed, 1927 Wood body Dairy Delivery truck
- Location: Westminster, CO
- MTFCA Number: 32583
- Board Member Since: 2017
Re: outside of track measurement
Hi Tim,
I just measured our delivery truck (on a car frame) at 67" outside of fender to outside of fender in the FRONT. Keep in mind YOU still need to be able to get in and out of the vehicle INSIDE the trailer, and get OUT of the trailer.
The first trailer we purchased was only 12' long. It had a piece of angle iron on the outside of the wheel track line on each side. If a person drives the vehicle on to the trailer, the angle iron will not be enough to keep the tires between them. It would let the driver know he's too far to one side or the other when the tire rides up on to the top of the angle. I took them off.
Concerning winches. Unless you are able to remove the winch easily, mount it securely and purchase a winch model most people would not be too interested in, to prevent theft. Harbor Freight winches are good considering how much a Model T owner would use one. One word of caution: The advertised winch pulling capacity is based on using a "snatch" block pulley and running the cable from the winch to the snatch block and back to a tie off at the winch area. Thus, there will be double the winch's actual pulling capacity than when using the cable straight to the item to be winched. This two part set up is what the advertised winch pulling capacity is based on. One part is HALF of the advertised capacity. One good thing: The snatch blocks HF is selling now are so much better than the ones they sold a few years ago.
When winching from the front, use a nylon web sling and go around the front motor mount/spring mount where the crank comes out. Do not put any pressure/tension on the crank or it will bend. I have not winched from the rear so I do not know the best place for that. I would suggest finding a way to get around a part of the frame, preferably at the top center where the spring mounts. Sometimes you can and sometimes you can't. Just beware the front axle is not as strong as we would like it to be.
Good Luck,
Terry
I just measured our delivery truck (on a car frame) at 67" outside of fender to outside of fender in the FRONT. Keep in mind YOU still need to be able to get in and out of the vehicle INSIDE the trailer, and get OUT of the trailer.
The first trailer we purchased was only 12' long. It had a piece of angle iron on the outside of the wheel track line on each side. If a person drives the vehicle on to the trailer, the angle iron will not be enough to keep the tires between them. It would let the driver know he's too far to one side or the other when the tire rides up on to the top of the angle. I took them off.
Concerning winches. Unless you are able to remove the winch easily, mount it securely and purchase a winch model most people would not be too interested in, to prevent theft. Harbor Freight winches are good considering how much a Model T owner would use one. One word of caution: The advertised winch pulling capacity is based on using a "snatch" block pulley and running the cable from the winch to the snatch block and back to a tie off at the winch area. Thus, there will be double the winch's actual pulling capacity than when using the cable straight to the item to be winched. This two part set up is what the advertised winch pulling capacity is based on. One part is HALF of the advertised capacity. One good thing: The snatch blocks HF is selling now are so much better than the ones they sold a few years ago.
When winching from the front, use a nylon web sling and go around the front motor mount/spring mount where the crank comes out. Do not put any pressure/tension on the crank or it will bend. I have not winched from the rear so I do not know the best place for that. I would suggest finding a way to get around a part of the frame, preferably at the top center where the spring mounts. Sometimes you can and sometimes you can't. Just beware the front axle is not as strong as we would like it to be.
Good Luck,
Terry
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- Posts: 335
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 5:25 pm
- First Name: John
- Last Name: Saylor
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1921 Touring, 1927 Tudor
- Location: Citrus Heights, Ca
- MTFCA Number: 1695
- MTFCI Number: 23870
- Board Member Since: 1999
Re: outside of track measurement
You stated, "I want to make loading slots - a board on the inside and the outside of the tires on the trailer ramp and floor."
I find it very tricky to try to drive a Model T within narrow slots. I make my ramps 10-12" wide to give me plenty of wiggle room as I drive Into A Trailer.
I find it very tricky to try to drive a Model T within narrow slots. I make my ramps 10-12" wide to give me plenty of wiggle room as I drive Into A Trailer.
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Topic author - Posts: 7
- Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2022 8:23 pm
- First Name: Timothy
- Last Name: Keith-Lucas
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 depot truck
- Location: Carrabelle, FL
Re: outside of track measurement
First, I want to thank all of you for the heads up on the height of the windshield. That had not occurred to me. As near as I can measure from the pictures, the top of the windshield is 80 inches above the ground. That means a special order trailer, about double the cost, and more windage, which is more important along the coast of Florida than other places. But: The previous owner has taken the windshield off, because he was surprised by the same problem. Second, this Model T is not going to the sorts of car shows where you lose points for using phillips screws rather than straight blade screws in your woodwork. It's for fun shows where you give the kids a ride. Every small town in north Florida has bunches of festivals it can go to and be fun. So, I think that the answer is that I will make the minimum changes necessary to make it reasonably simple to take the windshield off and put it back on without noticeably changing its appearance. I have not seen the woodwork, but there aare only so many ways of assembling something.
Back to reinforcing the floor and guiding the T into the trailer. The track is 56" or 28" from the mid line. THat's to the center of the tires. Take away half of a 3 1/2" wide tire plus an inch wiggle room and put the tire side of the inside 2x4 at 25 1/4" from the center line. To the 28" add half of a 3 1/2" tire and an inch wiggle room and put the inside of the outter 2x4 at 30 3/4" from the center line. Does that sound right? I'll put the 2x4s in place with long screws from on top, so if I have to move two of them (too wide or too narrow) it won't be difficult.
Back to reinforcing the floor and guiding the T into the trailer. The track is 56" or 28" from the mid line. THat's to the center of the tires. Take away half of a 3 1/2" wide tire plus an inch wiggle room and put the tire side of the inside 2x4 at 25 1/4" from the center line. To the 28" add half of a 3 1/2" tire and an inch wiggle room and put the inside of the outter 2x4 at 30 3/4" from the center line. Does that sound right? I'll put the 2x4s in place with long screws from on top, so if I have to move two of them (too wide or too narrow) it won't be difficult.
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- Posts: 29
- Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2020 9:47 pm
- First Name: Ned
- Last Name: Lloyd
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1924 Coupe, 1924 huckster
- Location: Moosup Ct
- MTFCA Number: 0
- Board Member Since: 2020
Re: outside of track measurement
It sounds like you have a workable plan.
Keep in mind that moving a T backwards (on or off a trailer) the steering really likes to flop over to one side or the other, so you really need someone at the wheel.
Also, as mentioned a bit, you don’t want to secure a T by the front axle. In addition to bending the axle, the ball and socket on the end of the wishbone (front suspension part) isn’t made for pulling and can be broken by pulling. Look at the oil pan on the front of the flywheel pan and you will see the ball and socket. It is best to secure them up top where the spring meets the frame.
Keep in mind that moving a T backwards (on or off a trailer) the steering really likes to flop over to one side or the other, so you really need someone at the wheel.
Also, as mentioned a bit, you don’t want to secure a T by the front axle. In addition to bending the axle, the ball and socket on the end of the wishbone (front suspension part) isn’t made for pulling and can be broken by pulling. Look at the oil pan on the front of the flywheel pan and you will see the ball and socket. It is best to secure them up top where the spring meets the frame.
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- Posts: 6430
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:18 am
- First Name: Scott
- Last Name: Conger
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: '13, '15, '19, '23
- Location: Clark, WY
- Board Member Since: 2005
Re: outside of track measurement
Model "T"s can be a bit of a handful backing up due to the steering geometry. Backing up quickly can risk having the steering wheel want to take your hands off at the wrist if not careful...having guide slots for loading may seem to make sense but can lead to a pack of trouble backing up if a tire pecks at the guide slot it will want to wrench itself out of there and go anywhere but straight. Unload with the winch...not under power.
I am going to stick my neck out and say that after your trip home with it, including loading/unloading, you will quickly become un-enamored with this setup.
that said, welcome to the hobby
I am going to stick my neck out and say that after your trip home with it, including loading/unloading, you will quickly become un-enamored with this setup.
that said, welcome to the hobby
Scott Conger
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
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- First Name: Mark
- Last Name: Chaffin
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1911 Speedster, 1927 Lake Roadster
- Location: Lake Elsinore
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Re: outside of track measurement
Rent one of these 6 x 12 utility trailers from UHaul $35.00! Both a stock T and TT fit perfectly inside. Been there. Done that numerous times.