MTFCA Forum

I am installing new widows in my 27 coupe. I am having difficulty with one of the door windows. I can not seem to get it to go up level. It always touches on one side at the top and leaves a gap on the other. Has anyone had this problem, and how did you solve. it -- Thanks for any help-----Joe. joeg48@hotmail.com

I don’t think the glass dimensions are perfectly square. Would you consider removing the glass, turn it around front to back, and reinstall it ?

Have you already replaced the other windows? If they fit then you may have this one placed the wrong way.

The glass across the top has a slight angle. A close fit in the felt channels on each side of the glass holds the glass level. Did you allow for this angle when you had the door glass cut? There are booklets that have the precise measurements of all Model T glass. I had the one that provided the dimensions for all glass for all 1926-‘27 Model T styles. When I had the (6) pieces of glass cut for my 1926 Coupe, using the dimensions in the booklet, the glass all fit perfect. Jim Patrick

Joe, I just started installing the window glass in my 1927 coupe. I noticed the same thing you are describing. When I get to the garage today, I will do some measurements at the top of the door when it is rolled all the way up.

The glass book (Windshield and Closed Body Glass) shows the front of glass as 19 inches and the back as 19 7/8 inches. I verified those dimensions on the original glass and gave those dimensions to my glass supplier. I have not installed the rubber cushion that fits into the top of the door, maybe that will take into account the difference in those dimensions.

Joe, Here is what my situation is with the driver side window.

It is apparently like what you have. I will try to show it with the attached photos. There is a gap at the left side of the window. The replacement glass is as is shown in the glass book. It is 20" on the rear of the door and 19" on the front. I do not understand why there is the gap.

I have just started to install the window glass on the passenger side. It appears it will not have the gap as on the drivers side.

Is your situation the same as mine? Do you have any idea what the problem is?


































H

that glass is in backwards

the small dimension (19) goes to the front

The 19" is in the front.

Bruce, I was hoping you had the answer..... I am using 1/4" glass and I purchased my first felt channels from Lang's and the second set from Snyders. The slot on the Snyders is much wider. The slot in the channel using the Lang product was too narrow for my 1/4" glass to slide easily. I am not sure what thickness of glass you are using. Why, one side of the glass travels slower/faster than the other is a mystery. I wish I could reposition the actuator arm on the regulator. As it seems to be off center in its track, which seems to cause the glass to lift unevenly.

One of the things I have tried , was to add a long spring to the side of the glass that was hitting too soon, hoping to slow its travel. It is extremely difficult to find the right tension. It is extremely touchy!!! The spring keeps stretching losing tension. I am going to keep working at it, I hope you will as well. If you come up with an answer let me know, and I will do the same.
Joe

Be absolutely sure the glass is not reversed or mis-cut. Is it possible the metal channel on the bottom of the glass is reversed or damaged in some way? Lack of lubrication on the riser mechanism can cause glass to bind in the felt channels. Anything that causes the glass to bind, even a little, on one side can cause the glass to tend to jam as it goes up. A door that is sprung slightly might cause that, or anything that made the glass run tighter on one side than the other. It's not uncommon for windows to behave that way if there are any of several problems with the riser mechanism, such as excess friction, or any problem that adds too much friction to the one of the channels the glass slides in. The glass needs some friction in the felt channels to stay tight and rattle-free and stay rolled up, but friction needs to be even on both sides or the glass will tend to bind. Binding from any cause is usually worse when the glass is going up rather than going down.


"As it seems to be off center in its track, which seems to cause the glass to lift unevenly"

Be sure none of the parts are reversed, and be sure the moving and sliding parts have some lubrication. I've used the white grease type lubricant on window riser mechansims with good results. Apply sparingly and only where needed.

....I wonder if he ever figured it out ? He sure got plenty of good advice....it would seem to be of a help to the T community to receive an after-action report ....

George

I agree, and it was TWO guys, to boot!

hard to believe that a tapered glass could tilt sufficiently as to appear installed backwards...the side-to-side (width) clearance in the side channels would have to be enormously large to allow a glass to tilt that much.

I have not figured out my problem yet. I also wonder what Joe has found out.

Bruce, I have recently gone through the struggles of installing Tudor door glass so have a lot of sympathy for what you are going through. I'm no expert and am actually avoiding doing the back seat windows after all the "fun" that I had with the first two.

Can you determine if the glass is actually tilting as it rises towards the top?

My first thought is that the tapered piece of glass may be installed backwards on the track. I was quite surprised how much of a slope was on my windows and installing the glass backwards would make it impossible to close them. A sloped piece of glass could look like tilting movement as it approaches the top. When you are almost at the top of the movement, can you move the glass from side to side or is it well held by the channels. If constrained well, it might not be tilting to create this problem but some other issue shows up as a top gap for you.

The replacement support tracks are quite different lengths than the originals. I installed the track right where the original had been located on the old glass but that wasn't such a great idea. My first attempt had the regulator wheel actually run off the end of the shorter channel of the replacement track. I had to pull the track off the window and reposition it to contain the full run of the regulator. The new regulators are a good duplication of the originals and no problems found there. If your glass is tilting because of an off-center track, it is an easy matter to remove and move over to a better spot.

Perhaps the support track has not been completely installed at one end so the tilted regulator acts differently on lifting the glass as it moved from end to end (and back again) during its travel? The regulator wheel starts at one end of the window track, travels to the other end, and then back to the starting point when the window reaches the limit of its travel. This arc means that the wheel works on one end of the glass twice during each opening and closing. A tilted track would be accentuated by this double action on one end.

The window channels that I installed contain the new windows quite tightly so they can't tilt during its travel and are forced to stay parallel with the track through the entire travel - so I didn't get any tilting issues ...... or have windows that are particularly easy to move. If your glass is tilting, it might be cut slightly too narrow and allowed to wobble about on its up and down journey.

I don't know why there are so many issues possible with such an easy concept and I thought I've discovered most of them. However, I'll follow your challenge and see what new monsters I have to watch out for on the next 2 windows that I have been avoiding.

Joe, Answers to you questions:

The glass is in correctly, with the shorter side to the front.

The glass is inserted evenly in the metal bottom channel.

I used the original bottom channels (the replacement channels were too short as you mentioned).

I can't move the glass side to side as it approaches the top, as it is firmly held by the side channels.

The glass fits very tight into the side channels.

You asked if the glass is actually tilting as it rises towards the top. I will try to determine this.

Did you have a gap at the top rear like mine? I can close most of the gap by pulling up on rear of the glass after it reaches the top. This problem is really frustrating!! I may have to just live with it!

I have a hard time turning the handle with rolling up the glass. Did you have this problem?

Hi Bruce,

This must be really frustrating and I suspect that living with this issue really isn't going to work for you. There has to be a solution to this challenge.

If the channels are tight, there won't be much room for the glass to tilt during its travel I'm thinking.

Does the glass actually tilt on the way up the channel or is the angle at the top of the window different from the window frame. I'm wondering if the glass has been cut to exactly match the slope of the top of the frame. With the window near the bottom of the opening, is the distance between the glass and the top of the opening the same at the front and the back of the glass? If the same dimension, the window is tilting on the way up but if the dimensions are different, the top of glass angle does not match the top of frame angle so can top out leaving a gap at one end.

If all else fails, one oddball idea is to have the glass recut to create the exact angle you need at the top and give you the perfect seal that you are after.

Joe, Did you have the gap problem, and does your handle turn hard when rolling up the window?

If the glass is too tight in the channel, making it hard to roll up, that can cause the glass to tilt or try to jam. the lifting mechanism, as pointed out above, does not push straight upward on the glass during most of its travel. The glass should roll up fairly smoothly and easily. A great many door glasses will try to tilt or bind if they are either too loose or too tight in the channels. Any paint or glue in the fuzzy channel can cause the glass to drag. Anything that causes a tight spot in the channel can cuase trouble. The sides of the door glasses that run in the channels need to be polished smooth and slightly rounded. The corners of the glass probably ought to have a very slight radius, rather than a square corner, and they need to be very smooth.