New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

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Jmeredith
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New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Fri Jan 06, 2023 12:53 pm

Greetings to all,
I am trying to restore a 26 coupe that my father bought back in the early 70's. I was not here during the time he was doing the disassemble as I had just joined the service. To say the least it is an adventure trying to put all the pieces back together. He did quite a bit of work on it but it has been in storage for the past 25 odd years. There are some questions I have for the group. I believe this is a coupe (all metal) with no wood around the windows. I have researched all I can find on the forum but can't be certain. Can someone verify this for me? Pictures attached. Also there were no seat springs and the associated wood pieces that attach to the springs that I can find. I cannot find any pieces of the package tray and am not certain whether it was all wood or some metal. I'm just getting started and have ordered quite a bit of parts.

I believe I can reproduce this wood for the seat bottom, seat back and package tray. If someone has the templates or the dimensions. Any help appreciated.
I hope the upload of the pictures work.....

Jesse in North Carolina.
Attachments
interior4.jpg
interior3jpg.jpg
interior2.jpg
interior1.jpg


ModelTWoods
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by ModelTWoods » Fri Jan 06, 2023 1:22 pm

You do have a 26-27 coupe. Even though you may have a title that says 26, or a motor block with a 26 serial number, it is my understanding that most, if not all 27's had no wood around the windows, but 26 coupes did. My coupe is a 27 with no wood (except for the roof. The seat springs should be available from Snyder's or Lang's. They do have some wood attached to the springs. If the wood is not available from vendors, you may find pictures previously posted on this forum. I have an extra metal package tray if you need it; just pay freight, either by USPS or Fedex.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Les Schubert » Fri Jan 06, 2023 1:42 pm

In regards to seat location.
If you are tall or perhaps getting older and less agile, then one of the nice things about this body style is that it is comparatively easy to move the seat back to facilitate easier “fit” of you to the car. I have been playing with T’s for almost 50 years and I am 6’4” tall and I am now finding that my 27 roadster is becoming less comfortable.
So I am embarking on a 26 coupe project with the plan to relocate the seat to be more comfortable as I plan to do some long distance driving in it.
Just a thought for you to consider.

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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Steve Jelf » Fri Jan 06, 2023 1:53 pm

Good engine color. It's mighty close to original.

443190.jpg
The inevitable often happens.
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1923 Touring


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Fri Jan 06, 2023 2:08 pm

Terry-
It is my understanding some of these 26 coupes had all wood package trays. Not sure if mine was supposed to or not. If metal was supposed to be attached then could you post a picture I may be interested.
I have the seat springs already (my dad had ordered them) you can see one piece on the floor beside the front end picture. There are no wood pieces attached to these. I think they were bought from Snyders way back..

Les-
I'm 6'4" also. Hopefully the rearmost position on the seat bottom will work. If not my son who is 5'11" should be ok.

Steve - Great to hear. What color is the valve cover usually painted? I was going to use high temp glossy black??

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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Steve Jelf » Fri Jan 06, 2023 2:40 pm

The memo doesn't mention the valve cover, but I'm guessing engine color.

ENGINE PAINTING.jpg
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by John kuehn » Fri Jan 06, 2023 2:46 pm

That’s a good looking car you have. Really nice shape and not rusted up. I don’t know if your Father cleaned up the inside of the body but it is a nice solid original. Did he paint the engine? These days it’s hard to get the right shade of green. It is pretty close but it may have gotten closer to correct if you Father painted it years ago and it’s faded after many years.
Glad you leaving it an original car and not :roll: hot rod it like some have done to the all metal body T’s.

Another thing to check on now since the body is apart is the gas tank condition! The 26 - 27 T gas tanks are a little harder to remove and work on than the earlier T’s!
Now a is good time to make sure it’s OK before you put it back together!


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jerry VanOoteghem » Fri Jan 06, 2023 2:54 pm

The valve cover on my '26 Fordor is black. Dad would have painted it the same color as it was originally, when purchased by my grandfather.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Les Schubert » Fri Jan 06, 2023 3:04 pm

I just looked at my early production Canadian 26 coupe and there is No wood around the rear windows. My understanding is that in fact Ford converted some of this area to wood framing for the 27 model.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Fri Jan 06, 2023 7:01 pm

Steve-
Thanks for the memo.

So I believe I will go with black on the valve cover....

John-
I believe my dad painted the engine, I'm not sure whether anything was done to the engine. I remember he said they cranked it and ran it around the yard, is all I can remember...
There was no gas tank that I could find. I found one on ebay and had to pick it up in NJ. boy that drive was fun....not used to all that traffic...I took it to the radiator shop and they cleaned and made it right...so good to go there.

Thanks to all that have responded.

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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Mopar_man » Fri Jan 06, 2023 8:10 pm

Jesse,
I've been working on a 26 for some time now. Mine is a touring but most of the mechanical stuff is the same. Ipost lots of pictures. The people on the forum are very helpful so ask away.

Here is the thread for our car.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=9508


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Moxie26 » Fri Jan 06, 2023 8:48 pm

Curious.... if the seat is changed to the rearmost position how much leg room is gained and would there be a smaller shelf if any behind the seat backrest. Also.. a seat in that position will or will not change access to the battery ??


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by ModelTWoods » Sat Jan 07, 2023 12:44 pm

ModelTWoods wrote:
Fri Jan 06, 2023 1:22 pm
You do have a 26-27 coupe. Even though you may have a title that says 26, or a motor block with a 26 serial number, it is my understanding that most, if not all 27's had no wood around the windows, but 26 coupes did. My coupe is a 27 with no wood (except for the roof. The seat springs should be available from Snyder's or Lang's. They do have some wood attached to the springs. If the wood is not available from vendors, you may find pictures previously posted on this forum. I have an extra metal package tray if you need it; just pay freight, either by USPS or Fedex.
Jesse, look up: fordwood.com They make and have a list of all wood used in 26-27 coupes.


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Jmeredith
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Sat Jan 07, 2023 12:57 pm

Terry I looked at the site you mentioned, it does not list the wood for the seat bottom/back. I think I have enough pictures to figure it out though..


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Sat Jan 07, 2023 1:03 pm

Thanks Robert. I have been looking at some of the posts..


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Distagon2 » Sat Jan 07, 2023 1:57 pm

Your pictures bring back memories of when I restored my grandfather's 26 Coupe back in the 1980's. His was in nowhere the condition yours is in, it took an enormous amount of work due to rustout, etc. His 26 Coupe is engine serial number 125468XX which indicates an October 1925 build date. This means it was one of the early "improved" cars. His coupe did not have the wood framing around the rear window but the metal as shown in your picture. It is also my understanding that the wood framing came later in 26-27 production. One advantage to the wood framing is if you need to work any dents out of the panel you can get to both sides of it.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Nathan Pederson » Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:57 pm

Jesse,
Similar to your car, my 26 coupe did not have any seat wood or a package tray. I was fortunate
to take measurements and some templates from a totally original barn find coupe that a friend had.
Raccoons had eaten away most of the upholstery so that made the job easier.

Bottom seat frame. Note that the sides are not straight, they are curved:
Dimensions.JPG

Template showing the curved bottom seat edge on the left side of picture:
Template1.jpg

Bottom seat frame is made from 3/4" oak. (Upholstery color is not original)
Upholstery on the barn find car was tacked into a 1/16" deep X 3/4" wide rabbet.
You can see that detail on mine:
Seat.jpg
The holes that fit onto the seat riser are placed as original and you would want to set the seat to
the rear as much as possible for leg room.


The "Ford Service Manual" has good info and pictures about moving the seat back.
Highly recommended book.
Service.JPG

I have some seat backrest and package tray details also and could post that later.
The package trays I have seen have a curved sheet metal covered with upholstery that is then
attached to a horizontal wooden shelf.
Last edited by Nathan Pederson on Sat Jan 07, 2023 10:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by jiminbartow » Sat Jan 07, 2023 10:14 pm

Your 1926 coupe is correct without wood around the windows. My 1926 coupe, manufactured in March, 1926 has no wood around the windows either. Some 1926 coupes had wood and some didn’t. Jim Patrick

A37DA394-F128-462C-8D34-8E0389CE56C4.jpeg

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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Craig Leach » Sat Jan 07, 2023 10:42 pm

Hi Jesse,
Welcome to the hobby/affliction, Thank you for your service. You found the place to get the info you need there is a wealth of info on
this Forum. Hope you have as much fun as we do and congrats on fallowing the tradition.
Craig.


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Jmeredith
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Sun Jan 08, 2023 12:59 pm

Nathan,
That is exactly what I need, thanks so much. My engine s/n is 12494960 (Oct. 1925) The frame s/n is 13417658 (March of 26), It also has a number on the cross member of the body in front of the seat (077065 B) not sure what that signifies?
I have some red oak that should work nicely..

Does yours have the metal piece attached to the package tray or not? And if not how is it attached to the body?
Yes post the package tray detail if you would thanks.

Now all I need is the detail on the seatback wood and how it is attached. I see how it is attached on the bottom. On the top I have seen it displayed for the cars with wood around the windows but not sure on the all metal bodies..

Jim, that is one SWEET looking ride....


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by jab35 » Sun Jan 08, 2023 1:57 pm

Jesse: The upper part of the seatback rests against the front of the package tray and is held in place at the center with a metal tab that slips into a slot in the top of package tray. The Ford service chapter might show that detail. Package tray may be all metal or rear barrel-shaped part metal, front flat part of wood. Don Booth posted many pictures and measurements of '26 Coupes he restored. Do a Google search with some combination of the words MTFCA forum1926 coupe Don Booth. I know there's a bunch of photos of old and restored seatbacks for '26 coupes in Don's many posts. If you have questions, or difficulty finding exactly what you need, PM me and I'll share the file information I collected when I did my '26, information that came from the aforementioned sources and measurements of the remains of the original wood bits. Good luck, jb


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by John kuehn » Sun Jan 08, 2023 2:21 pm

Glad your getting the Coupe figured out! The wood in a 26 Coupe is kind of like other T issues in other T’s. As time goes on you’ll find that all T’s of a certain year aren’t all exactly alike! Ford had changes here and there besides having different body makers. If you get your T 95% as it came from the factory your doing pretty good!


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by jab35 » Mon Jan 09, 2023 1:00 pm

Jesse: I just now sent you a reply to the PM, including these links:


Don Booth all steel coupe restore
https://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/3 ... 1385415681

Package tray pics
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/80257/103517.html

Seatback and package tray
https://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/3 ... 1386509550

best, jb


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Nathan Pederson » Mon Jan 09, 2023 5:17 pm

Hi Jesse,
Looks like jab35 has posted some very helpful information!
If needed, I can still post what I have.
I really like my '26 coupe, you have an excellent car there.
Nathan


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Mon Jan 09, 2023 11:41 pm

Thanks James I will check those out.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Distagon2 » Tue Jan 10, 2023 5:47 am

In jab35's posting with the links, pay close attention to the process of squaring the body as shown in the first link. That process is essential to getting the doors to fit right.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Tue Jan 10, 2023 9:13 am

I was looking at that,my brother-in-law put a new top and wood on the car at some point I have noticed that others have stated in order to get the headliner in correctly I may have to remove the top to accomplish that. Will need to figure out how it is attached.
Going to work on the wood for seats today.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by jab35 » Tue Jan 10, 2023 10:34 am

Jesse: Classitique has some excellent videos of top, headliner and upholstery installation. The video at the bottom of this page is of a '26-'27 Tudor but the procedure would be similar for your coupe. jb

https://www.classtiqueupholstery.com/in ... ion-videos


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Distagon2 » Tue Jan 10, 2023 11:47 am

I restored my 26 coupe back when I was in my 20's and didn't know about squaring up the body. So, I could never get the doors to fit right. Now 40+ years later I plan to re-restore the car which will require removing the top and wood. Then get things "squared up" and install the wood as described earlier. If you already have your top on, maybe you should hang your doors and see how they line up. If they are ok, you have nothing to worry about. If they sag, now is the time to address it.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Line_Noise » Wed Jan 11, 2023 9:12 pm

Jmeredith wrote:
Sun Jan 08, 2023 12:59 pm
Nathan,
That is exactly what I need, thanks so much. My engine s/n is 12494960 (Oct. 1925) The frame s/n is 13417658 (March of 26), It also has a number on the cross member of the body in front of the seat (077065 B) not sure what that signifies?
I have some red oak that should work nicely..
My 1927 Coupe S/N 14,700,000s February 1927 has the same style body number, mine is 167127 B, the "B" has been speculated to be manufacturer designation for Briggs. I had thought that the "27" at the end of my number meant that the number was a date code of some sort, but after seeing yours maybe the numbers are just assigned consecutively?

When my car was repainted and had the top redone, steel channels were welded across the door gaps and in an horizontal "X" cross brace pattern to keep things in alignment until the new wood could be fitted.


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Jmeredith
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Thu Jan 12, 2023 7:55 pm

Yep, that sounds plausible for the cross member number.
I’m not sure whether they braced the door openings when they put the top on but I haven’t had a chance to hang the doors yet. I need to find some screws and such first.
I was able to work on the seat bottom wood today almost finished with that.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Nathan Pederson » Sat Jan 14, 2023 4:42 pm

Hi Jesse,
Here are wood package shelf measurements from an original 26 coupe (the car had wood around the quarter side and rear windows).
Note how the seat fits into it.
Tray Wood.JPG


And measurements for a half side of the metal curved piece:
I made one for my car.
Shelf Metal.JPG


Here's how my package shelf looks:
Package Shelf.JPG


Top wood rail on the seat backrest (left half shown and viewed from the front) is a little complicated as the ends curve in two directions:
Seat Top Wood.JPG


Back side of the seat backrest I added a 1/2" plywood piece (where the tacks are) to cover up the springs.
Seat Back.JPG

Seems like adjustments always have to be made to get things to fit and look ok.
Nate


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Jmeredith
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Sun Jan 15, 2023 10:39 am

Thanks Nathan, that is very helpful. I believe I have enough to make what I need.


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Jmeredith
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Sun Jan 15, 2023 4:36 pm

Got a little more done on the seat back and bottom.
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Distagon2 » Sun Jan 15, 2023 5:51 pm

Looking good!!


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Thu Jan 26, 2023 2:57 pm

Finished up the wood backrest and bottom.

Can anyone tell me why there is a bolt with a long shoulder installed here?


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:02 pm

Can someone tell me why the long shouldered bolt is here go?
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jab35
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by jab35 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 4:06 pm

That looks like a pivot bolt for a pre-'26 fan arm. The '26-'27 used an entirely different Fan Assembly where the fan axle was mounted in an eccentric that could be rotated in a 'bearing' in the water outlet casting that bolted to the head. The fan belt tension was adjusted by rotating the eccentric bushing and then clamping it in place. Is your engine earlier than 1926? jb


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Jmeredith
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:57 pm

The eccentric you are speaking of is above where this is. This appears to be in one of the top bolt holes for the timing cover?? Here is another picture
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TRDxB2
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by TRDxB2 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 2:48 am

Here is some reference material
This is a link to a lot of Model T documents
This is the link to the 1926 Body Parts list scroll down to the 1926 Coup, body wood, followed by sheet metal and then interior
https://www.cimorelli.com/mtdl/1926/default.htm
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by jab35 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 12:39 pm

The timing cover in your pic is from a pre '26. The lug with the threaded hole and bolt you show identifies a cover of earlier vintage. You don't need that long bolt, but you do need a bolt. Best, jb

ps:
Cimorelli's is a great resource. The item of interest is "Parts list-MAY". The wood coupe body shown is pre '26, but later versions are shown in the May parts list on the Cimorelli link. Thanks for posting that link! jb


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Distagon2 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 4:32 pm

If in fact you need a 26-27 timing cover I have a half dozen of them, and could part with one.....


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Scott_Conger » Fri Jan 27, 2023 5:03 pm

Boy, I sure would not remove an earlier timing cover just for the experience. It isn't doing any harm there and if the engine is rebuilt and everything is sealed up, I wouldn't mess with it until there was a darn good reason in the future. Install the proper water outlet on the head that belongs there and be done with it. Maybe I'm lazy...actually, yes, I'm lazy when it comes to this stuff. If it was a rare car and it just had to be "right" that's one thing, but trying to get a car on the road to enjoy it, I'd spend the time and effort on things that HAD to be done. This isn't one of them.

After you've enjoyed tooling around in it for 6 months (whenever that happens) if it really bothers you, change it then.
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by speedytinc » Fri Jan 27, 2023 5:31 pm

If you change out the cover, you need a special tool to center the cover to the cam.
Of course, you dont know if the current cover is correctly centered. This is important for accurate cylinder firing.
I would want to know.
The thing to do is to get the gauge or check the centering by other means. Acquire the correct cover. If the current cover needs to be removed to correctly center, put the correct one on.
I am with Scott to not be in a hurry to replace the current cover if not necessary.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Sun Jan 29, 2023 5:50 pm

So let me get this straight…. This is earlier timing cover with the wrong bolt installed? How do you determine the difference between the two covers. Here is another picture.
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by speedytinc » Sun Jan 29, 2023 7:09 pm

That bolt is the fan arm pivot bolt.
See the threaded boss to the left?
Thats the adjusting bolt boss to tension the fan arm. A 26-7 wouldnt have this boss.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:38 pm

Ok, I think I understand what I’m seeing. As long as it will run with no problems with this cover all should be fine. I have installed a new outlet connector which has the correct eccentric and all should be good. The old one was very rusted out were it connected to the hose to the radiator. I am not planning on restoring and showing this car, just gonna try to fit in it and try to drive it and enjoy it.

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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Mark Nunn » Mon Jan 30, 2023 8:41 am

Jesse, I see that only one of the two bolts under your timer is installed correctly. Both bolts should be installed with the bolt head up. The bolt sticking up and split pin (on the left in your photo) can short out the timer if the timer contact touches it.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Mon Jan 30, 2023 9:39 am

Thanks for all the help, much appreciated.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Jmeredith » Fri Jan 05, 2024 9:49 pm

Finally finished painting, my ‘booth’ was a little small but I made do.
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Now I need to determine whether I should replace my bands. I’m not sure when they were changed but it must have been about at least 30 years ago !!
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It appears that the low band is worn more than the rest. Not sure why that would be. It would seem the brake band should have more wear right?
As I have the body off of the frame now would be the time to do it.
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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by Allan » Sat Jan 06, 2024 1:14 am

Definitely do the bands before the body goes on. Even if they weren't shot just yet, it is worth saving the angst of doing the job with the engine in the car.

Allan from down under.


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Re: New Member Restoring a 26 Coupe

Post by John Codman » Sat Jan 06, 2024 12:29 pm

With the frame and the engine being about a million numbers apart, that could not have been the engine that your car left the factory with. It is the correct engine, as it has the provision for the frame braces that were used in the improved car.
Be aware that the gas tank is an item that is not reproduced, so be careful with it. The subject of tank installation has been discussed on this forum, and my conclusion is that the cowl design varies a bit from body style to body style. My '27 is a touring car, and you cannot remove or install the tank with the steering column in place. Other members have said that you could swap the tank with the steering column in place on their Model T's. I'm not going to take a position on your coupe, but I will guarantee that tank installation will be easier if the column is not in place.

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