MTFCA Forum

I virtually don’t know anything about voltage regulators so be gentle ha. This horse has been beaten to death but I’m not sure I’ve read anything on the forum about using a 1940’s-50s automobile voltage regulator on a model T. I’m sure someone will be able to find an old post but thought I’d ask anyway. I’m a glutton for punishment, I have a 49 F100 that has a 6 volt system, generator & a voltage regulator on the firewall and I was wondering if it would be reasonably easy to use one on a model T. It appears that the Fun projects one (i have 3 T models that have them) will not be available for now & possibly into the future. Yes I know it’s not what Henry did but l’d like one anyway. So you guys with a ton of electrical expertise please teach me so I can learn. Best John

If you study the generator on your 50 Ford you will see that it has two connections on the generator. One is from the armature brush (the output) and one is from the field coil.
If you remove the “third brush “ connection from your T generator and bring it out, this you will connect to the regulator part of the voltage regulator. The output will connect to the “cutout” on your regulator.
If you want to try this I suggest removing the generator and rig up a way to spin the generator on the bench and test it all on the bench first to ensure that you have all the connections correctly done.

The '50 Ford pickup system will be positive ground. Also the regulator is probably adjusted for about 30 amps, which is too high for the T generator. A GM regulator from the same era will be negative ground, and probably also 30 amp. The 3rd brush on the T generator could be used to limit its total output. The internally grounded end of the T field coils would need to be disconnected from ground and brought out to a terminal on the generator case, then connected to the "F" or field terminal of the regulator. I'm pretty sure this would work, and would allow the modern regulator to replace the cutout on the T generator and provide voltage and current regulation within the limits of the T generator. The 3rd brush on the T generator would be left intact to supply the field circuit with power, and would limit the T generator's maxiumum output to the 3rd brush setting

JTT3 wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:16 pm

... I have a 49 F100 that has a 6 volt system, generator & a voltage regulator on the firewall and I was wondering if it would be reasonably easy to use one on a model T. ...

No, not easy

It could be done, I believe, and it would work well. Easy? Not so much. It would require taking the generator apart and modifying the field connections as described. All connections would need to be done correctly, and the new regulator would need to be mounted and connected properly and grounded to the generator. Then the 3rd brush would need to be adjusted to limit the T generator's maximum output to about 8 amps, and no more than 10 amps. The generator would need to be properly polarized, also.

The primary problem with using the later, 3-element style regulator with the T generator is that the T generator lacks an external field connection. The internal field current connection is made through the 3rd brush, which allows a limited manual adjustment of maximum field current. The other end of the circuit is permanently grounded inside the generator case.

The generators that were built with an external field connection had the field circuit internally connected directly to the armature output terminal, and used an automatic variable resistance device (regulator) to connect the field coils to ground.

JTT3 wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:16 pm

... It appears that the Fun projects one (i have 3 T models that have them) will not be available for now & possibly into the future. Yes I know it’s not what Henry did but l’d like one anyway....

John,

I realise you mentioned the '49 system you have, so I may be confused here, but from the above comment I took it that you wanted an electronic regulator as you have in your other T's?

If so, this thread may give some insight as to how you could achieve that: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=25609

Luke.

First all of the purists put your hands over your ears and repeat after me La,La,La,La,La, Wasn't there a guy Randy Johnson that sold
A-C Delco external regulated generators adapted for model T's I understood they worked very well and then someone started making
alternators that did the same? I for one am not a fan of T generators when I first got in T's I had a 5 out of 5 fail rate! I run a L.D. Becker
alternator on my firetruck because a T generator will not keep up with the siren. I run total loss on my speedster. Model T generators
taught me how to do that.
Craig.

A method that I have used as follows;
1. Disconnect the ground connection of the field winding and bring it out.
2. I then connect it to a reostat installed in the dashboard and connected to ground.
3. Now I can adjust the charging rate depending on condition ( lights, speed, distance driven)

Les's method is the least expensive. Some old tractors had a similar arrangement. You could even omit the rheostat and just add a switch, which would allow turning the generator completely off.

Voltage regulators from older automobiles may not provide the same level of regulation accuracy as modern aftermarketwordle regulators or reproductions designed specifically for vintage vehicles. This could affect the performance and reliability of the Model T's electrical system.

JTT3 wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:16 pm

I virtually don’t know anything about voltage regulators so be gentle ha. This horse has been beaten to death but I’m not sure I’ve read anything on the forum about using a 1940’s-50s automobile voltage regulator on a model T. I’m sure someone will be able to find an old post but thought I’d ask anyway. I’m a glutton for punishment, I have a 49 F100 that has a 6 volt system, generator & a voltage regulator on the firewall and I was wondering if it would be reasonably easy to use one on a model T. It appears that the Fun projects one (i have 3 T models that have them) will not be available for now & possibly into the future. Yes I know it’s not what Henry did but l’d like one anyway. So you guys with a ton of electrical expertise please teach me so I can learn. Best John

Why not buy one made for your 1949 F100 https://www.google.com/search?client=fi ... 9++49+F100
If you don't trust eBay then local Parts Suppliers would be able to get one
Model T VR's are currently being made by our forum Admin www.modeltregulators.com

Does not the newly available regulator from Jeff Stevenson serve the same purpose as the Fun Projects item now unavailable?

Allan from down under.

Allan wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 21, 2024 4:06 am

Does not the newly available regulator from Jeff Stevenson serve the same purpose as the Fun Projects item now unavailable?

Allan from down under.

Seems to be a lot of reinventing of the reinvented proverbial wheel lately. Cheapness?

Well Allen & Richard very critical eyes. If you note the original post is from 2023 over a year ago and previous to Jeff producing the regulator for sale. Sort of a “ fire, ready, aim” approach, well played. I am a very big advocate of Jeff’s Voltage regulator & followed the build thread they were involved in. Richard I’m sure it must have been my Cheapness, owning 2 1909’s. 1 1910, 1 1911, 1 1912, 1 1913 & 1 1914 finding those parts are really cheap, ha. I have a few of the newer black era T’s too plus other vehicles, this thread was in response to several threads spitballing the need or desire for a voltage regulator for their T’s that were not available at that time. My thought was to ask and see from those much more qualified than me, if it was a viable opportunity.

The posting date does require consideration.

In general, I have noticed a pattern of reworking items that have been reworked by contributors to the hobby such as cutouts, coil testers/adjusters to timers and distributors

Thanks for sharing with us what you got, it seems you might have more than your fair share of upkeep on your hands. I was not attempting to single anyone out in particular and apologize if it seemed so.

John, far from being critical, my query was simply to direct the poster to another source which may have suited his purpose, as did Frank.

It would appear the revival of the original post is down to some kind of generalised auto bot chiming in, over a year later.

I too am a supporter of Jeff's regulators. Three are on their way to me.

Allan from down under.

Harry may be new to the Forum, it was his 2nd post here and he likely was unaware of all the previous discussion on this topic over the years. Welcome to MTFCA Forum, Harry. Respectfully, jb

Allen & Richard all in jest I hope you understood that, if not “my hypocrisy knows no bounds.”

Allan wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 21, 2024 4:06 am

Does not the newly available regulator from Jeff Stevenson serve the same purpose as the Fun Projects item now unavailable?
Allan from down under.

Yup. Essentially it accomplishes the same exact thing albeit in a somewhat different way electronically speaking. I just checked and your package just made a pit stop in HONOLULU, HI. It should get to you in Australia on Thursday!

Good news to report on the regulator front. I finalized & tested the fully assembled circuit boards and a couple hundred of them will be here next week. I gotta say, hand building 150 of these things so far one at a time was taxing my tired, old, sometimes unsteady hands. I also just got 3 samples of the new cutout tops and they are literally perfect, so now I don't have to scrounge around any longer for more cores. 1000 of those will be here in March.

It's been an inspiring and humbling journey getting to this point and I have LOTS of folks in our community to thank for helping me get here. I have renewed appreciation for all the vendors who produce products for our hobby. Model T guys are such cheapskates (I'm squarely in that category btw), and it really takes some out of the box thinking to bring stuff to this market and do it in a cost effective way.

Jeff

Craig Leach wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:30 pm

First all of the purists put your hands over your ears and repeat after me La,La,La,La,La, Wasn't there a guy Randy Johnson that sold
A-C Delco external regulated generators adapted for model T's I understood they worked very well and then someone started making
alternators that did the same? I for one am not a fan of T generators when I first got in T's I had a 5 out of 5 fail rate! I run a L.D. Becker
alternator on my firetruck because a T generator will not keep up with the siren. I run total loss on my speedster. Model T generators
taught me how to do that.
Craig.

I have two of Randy's generators. They are modified Autolite generators. I have been running them for over 30 years. They work well. I hid the regulators under the dash.