MTFCA Forum

I put a New Day in and was not happy with it.

Marshal, sometimes it’s not the one component, but a combination of many. You didn’t sate why your dissatisfied.
I also put a New Day timer on my runabout, and was very pleased with the results. This was after I also replaced the spark plugs and plug leads, new wiring harness and had my coils rebuilt. It will go 45 mph if I feel daring.
r/s Bob

I use the New Day timer. They dont like oil inside. I installed a moderd seal and cleaning now is minimal.

What condition are the engine, coils, fuel systems in? Not enough information about why there seem to be issues. I and others that use them seem to be happy with the New Day. No timer in the world will help if the coils are out of wack or if compression is too low.

I've been using New Days for years on every Model T I own. If you are not happy with it, you are doing something wrong. Perhaps you purchased a reproduction from long ago, which were no good.

Over 50 years ago, a New Day timer ended all of the troublesome issues I had with the stock Ford timer. As Larry points out, there's a record of bad repro New Days, but good reports on the latest ones being made. Currently I'm running the TW that came on my T when I bought it, I re-faced the contact race and put in a new brush. I've had no trouble with it, but when it finally wears out, I will replace it with a New Day. Please give us a little more detail on your problems so we can help. How was the car running before you replaced the timer ? Is your New Day an original or a repro ? If a repro, when and where purchased ? There have been issues with cobbled up or re-fitted brushes. Pictures of your New Day timer and brush may also help. Good luck !! None of us like to see a Model T "pull up lame" if we can help.

My 11 has a roller and my 16 has a i-timer.

Back in the ‘70’s I put a BEST brand timer in my 27 roadster. They are white plastic of some sort. I’ve “trued” it at least once in the lathe, but it is still going strong after probably at least 15,000 miles. I should have bought a spare!!
One of the key things with any timer is having the front cover correctly centered. And, as stated, brush type timers don’t like oil!!
On my 13 I’m using a “trufire” after realizing that the Hienz coils never were any good and I was embarking on a 2500 mile trip.

I have used 2 dozen roller timers both used and reproduction with just oil for the last 50 years on 7 different cars. Yes, there is probably a better way.
Rich

Anderson flapper timer, best all year touring timer, with no daily or weekly maintenance, just annual inspection.

But... for my '27 touring, which is the wife's favorite for tours, the I-Timer, it's ideal.

Any of the three timers, New Day, Anderson or a good roller timer will run fine on a T IF your cars electrical system is ok. Nothing beats a rebuilt coil box and new wiring. If those 2 components has an issue a new timer won’t fix it.
I have 3 T’s. 2 with New Days and the other T with an Anderson. They are working fine. How good are your coils. That’s another component that has to be in good shape for a good running T.

Since you replaced the timer was your T having an issue before you did?

Been work on Ts 35+ years never heard of a timer box?
Had great service from Anderson and the New Day although for a period new days where JUNK but seems tobe corrected now
Anderson only requires little contact lube each year and ND only a wipe out to clean
Most people issues is not the time but coil box and cheap / soft contacts and give them a clean and make sure they are tight and sing each year at inspection/servicing time

I have used New Day on all T's I have had and am now down to two. I spend some time at places like Hershey to look for the old style timer cap and have replaced the brush on several. I keep spares but never have used them. Probable need to sell some before someone calls me a "hoarder".

Hoarder
I could use a spare if that day ever comes

I use an E-Timer. Prior to that was a TW timer, and two Andersons before that. The first Anderson was actually very good, but after ten years it wore out, and the quality seemed to have dropped when I bought another one. Not that having to maintain the various parts of the car is a problem, but the E-Timer's consistent timing and complete absence of mechanical wear, plus the improvement in driving performance is what sold it on me.

I run a TW and love it. Had a bad repo New Day that never ran consistent. Now have a original with a brush I modified with a better spring. Runs as well as the TW.

I'm in the TW camp as well. Just take it off and blow the little bit of carbon dust out of there once a year. Been four year of great service out of it and I have yet to experience a problem with it. Just have to remember to keep that little wire that keeps the brush in its holder so you can install the timer cover.

Tiger you see nos ones from time to time

For a good many of us, the experience of driving a century-old car design isn't about convenience or reliability. Historical purists see frequently required maintenance and inconvenient breakdowns as part of the game. Others are just looking for fun and in a sense, they are purists, too—just of a different kind. They're okay with Volkswagen distributors and feel the same about putting demountable wheels on a pre-1919 Model T. Those things certainly improve the reliability of the car and if you're going to do a lot of touring, reliability counts for a lot.

I'm not a devout purist. For safety reasons, my car has three rear-view mirrors, extra stop-lamps, 4-way flashers, turn-signals and a 12-volt electrical system which also powers a self-starter. Hand-cranking is a no-no for me because I'm in personal possession of a stack of vertebra and discs seemingly in need of major surgery every eight years. No, because of circumstances, I can't afford to be a purist, but neither have I crossed over to the dark side. See, I'm of the position that part of the warp & woof of the Model T Ford is its famously cantankerous ignition system—one seemingly having been inspired by Great Britain's Lucas Company. Okay, okay; it's not really that bad. Once understood and mastered, the buzz-coils and timer are perfectly tamable, but they won't be as maintenance and trouble-free as the aforementioned Volkswagen distributor.

Simply put, timers are pigs. The fact that a new timer design has come out every year since the Model T started rolling off the assembly line, and that this creative process continues to this very day, is clearly indicative of that. I don't know that one type is much better than another. My car came with a Ford roller-timer with which I have developed a good deal of experience and familiarity; and as it's better to do combat with the enemy one knows rather than the enemy one doesn't know, I stuck with the roller. It's still a pig, but at least by now, I have that porcine SOB intimidated to the point of showing me some respect.


So okay, I'm on my second roller timer. The first one which came with the car when I bought it back in 2010 just plumb wore out. It did give me good, smooth acceleration, but needed cleaning quite often, same as its replacement. This new one, purchased from Lang's, was one of the last rebuilt units overhauled by an old-school machinist/timer expert of sterling reputation shortly before he passed away. It gets a squirt of 5W-30 motor oil every other day the car gets driven and I clean it out with WD-40 and a handful of paper towels every two or three fuel-ups. That seems to keep it more or less happy.

I've learned from experience that when the engine starts acting up, the most probable culprit is that blasted timer.
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"I have to LOL reading about how guys with other mechanical timers only have to service it once or twice a year. That must be when they take the car out for a drive? Every mechanical timer requires removing the cover and cleaning, lubing or polishing the contacts."

Hmm, Please don't tell my timer that. I bought it in Chickasha in 2006 and it has been in there the whole time. I did open it one day a few years ago out of curiosity to see how it looked. No lube, it just works. I have driven it to the covered bridge tour and back about 750 miles round trip. I drive it about 500-1000 miles per year most years. It runs like a timex, it just keeps on t'ing. It hasn't given me any trouble yet, so please don't tell it that it has been neglected and is worn out.

For my car, I had Ron P. rebuild the coils, installed all new wiring from ignition switch to plugs, put in a modern oil seal and centered the timing cover, and installed a New Day purchased from Langs. No issues since. No weak links in the chain. Cheers, Bill

I like my I Timer. It performed superbly on the California Dreamin tour.

Thomas distributor here.
Easily obtained 6V coil, points and condenser.
I check and adjust the points a couple times a year...
Let the flaming begin !!

I just bought a flip timer yesterday,have not tried it yet .I have new wiring, new rebuilt coils, engine is rebuilt, new gas tank, OF Stromberg carb..So I shell see Thanks for your info. PS. it is a 25 touring with a 26 engine.

flip timer? If the engine has been rebuilt make sure the bolt under the timer is pointing the correct direction, head should be on top. If it is pointing the other way, could be shorting out the terminal on the timer when advancing.

My New Day has performed fabulously for 20 year now in my 14 touring. Only ever had one issue when I had the engine out a couple of years ago for a transmission rebuild. Cleaned everything and checked the timer, no prob. Put it back together and no start. After a little head scratching I checked the timer and realized the little spring behind the timer brush had somehow fallen out. I substituted the spring from a ball point pen and it has worked fantastically since. I always carry a pen in the tool kit now.
Terry

Ford Roller... I buy all the NOS/like-new units when I find them because they are cheap and litter the swap meets. I put a new one on every year and keep on motoring. They work great. For some reason, I like my Model T to be a Model T. So the pre-tour maintenance is nostalgic for me.

One of my speedsters had a Bosch DU4 magneto. Loved it. Three other cars had distributors. One came to me with it, two, I installed during restoration because I had them. The rest had roller timers. Too many friends years ago had such bad luck with New Day (probably the bad repos?) timers that I swore I would never use one. However, in recent years the new ones seem to be okay. But I am hopelessly stubborn.
I have enough good roller timers to probably last the rest of my life. I made a jig and reground all the marginal ones I had, they came out nice. And I may consider going to another DU4 (i have one, and most of a mount for it).

I’d like to hear from people like me who drive their model T nearly every day. I think it’s a very different experience than the occasional drive. And for me it’s also city traffic to work and then pleasure drives in the evenings and weekends. So, more like how they were actually driven back in the model T era.

For 35 years I used Tiger timers which worked fine for a year or so and then the races eventually wore wonky with indentations on the surface. I switched to a flapper style for awhile and liked it, but the contacts seemed to wear quickly. I still keep a good one in my tool box for emergency.

After I rebuilt my ‘23 I used the TW timer for a couple of years and it ran nicely but my experience was that the brushes only lasted about eight months of driving. The coils were all rebuilt and tested. I did install a good seal when I put in the TW and that was a good move.

Right now I’m running with a vintage New Day and an OF carburetor. Still messing around with the OF as there are still some issues with irregular sustained running around 40+ mph. But in the city the speed limit is mostly 30-35 mph and the car is fine at those speeds. I had never used a New Day till now. Runs nicely so far and I like it. Just removed it the other day to inspect and aside from some dust and contact darkening seems fine. Cleaned the contacts with Scotchbrite and put it back in. I appreciate that there is a reliable E timer but I like the idea of using equipment from the model T era. Like I said .. I drive my ‘23 runabout nearly every day and have never had to leave it in the garage because of technical problems. A very reliable car.

Here it is with the pickup box installed for the summer ... in the parking lot of the George Eastman Museum where visitors always think it was George Eastman’s car.

On all the old cars I mess around with, I never scrimp on a few things....and ignition is on that short list. It's beyound irritating to spend countless hours reviving an old car only to have it run poorly because I've tried to save a few bucks on ignition components. I tend to not be satisfied with a car unless I can give it just the slightest hint that I want it to start and have it spring to life. My 66 F100 just needs the smallest turn of the key and it jumps to life. My 54 Ford tudor is the same way, and I'll make my 24 Touring behave the same way, with the starter or crank handle.

For that reason, I bought an iTimer and the ECCT with the associated software. In addition to using it on my own coils, I plan on using it to help local T guys tune their coils.

Once my shop is built and my T is up and running (both will happen soon if it will ever quit raining in Houston), I want to make myself available, free of charge, to any local T guy needing help with simple repairs on their car. (things like coils, wiring, seals, leaks, brakes, etc)

For what it's worth, the other components I won't scrimp on are steering, fuel system and brakes. I'm ok with stock brakes on a car as long as the engine is mostly stock. My rule is if you go bigger on horsepower, you need to go bigger on brakes. Stock fuel systems are almost always fine, but they need to be clean, tight and in excellent condition. I'm ok with aftermarket ignitions on mostly stock cars if I can completely hide them. Steering needs to be tight and dang near perfect from steering wheel to tires...no excuses. I'll putt around very slowly in my neighborhood with less than perfect steering while I'm getting a car up and running, but that's it.

No one has mentioned using a True Fire ignition. I see that they are available from Lang’s but Bittner Engineering’s website is gone. Does anyone know if they are still in business?

We have always used Tiger timers Dad picked up a stock of about 100 nos Tiger timers back in 1965 . The T uses 1 every 2-3 years, and its the roller that wears out. Cheers Colin

I have always used Tiger roller timers...just because the first one came that way and I was able to pick up a bunch of new 1970's version Tigers to have on the shelf.

I have a few Andersons new in a box on the shelf...always ready to try them but you can see how that goes, I have very little wear on the Tigers so the innards of those Anderson will need polishing before I even need to install the Anderson flapper type...

Now...to add to the personality of choice...

I bought the Hack in 2010 and when I took it out for a drive before purchasing it, it started and ran flawlessly. It was understood that the Hack had a Beta test E-timer that would not come with the purchase and a new roller timer would be installed with the sale. I have no desire to use an E, personal choice and not against the technology or the maker as I also got to see his test bench work on his software testing and was really impressed. I'd recommend it for others, just not for me.

It ran OK with the replacement but the roller timer only lasted 100 miles! The 'plastic' between the contacts had wallowed, and one of the contacts had cocked by maybe 20 degrees! It ran like crap on magneto before I found that, would get me home better on batt but it was still a struggle. On looking how wallowed it was, I was concerned that the camshaft might be jumping, but that did not seem to be the case. So...rather than install one of the new Andersons and risk what I thought could be an internal grenade for unknown reasons...I opened one of those 1970-ish Tigers and put it on. Sweet and still in there even thought the car hasn't been used the last year and a half due to health.

My cars tend to be tuned to start easy and even on mag and like I said the Tiger filled the bill nicely. Rather than oil it and clean it all the time, I tried the Royce P. trick after talking to Royce about it and decided to pack the timer housing with grease. As you might expect, the oil type can't 'conduct' and it does take a few pull throughs now to get the roller to mush out any grease that settled on the lobes after setting a bit, but it works and works well enough that I leave it in.

Turns out the wonky timer mentioned from 2010? Was one of the first made by brand 's' and even though I considered 100 miles a little too quick to wear out beyond repair. They told me it was my cam bearing being shot and not their timer...dang that Tiger tho'...must be bulletproof as it has worked fine without wear ever since :)

I remember Royce mentioning packing the timer housing with grease. Not sure how my car would start in cold weather with that stiff grease in there. Anyone have experience with this in the upper states?

Near as I can tell mine has a Tiger timer. I have no idea how many miles were on it when I got it but I tried to drive the T almost every day last summer and intend to do the same this year. So far so good, and the worn out cam seal keeps it well lubricated!

I bought about 4 NOS New Day timers and I will not use anything else. Low-maintenance and great performance.

I have been using a crystal timer. Clean it out once a year put around 3-4 k miles a year. Have it in there for 3 years now

Using the New-day timer that was on the car when my Great-Grandparents stopped running the truck. Works fine

All timers are adequate for normal touring and most driving situations if the ignition system is in good shape. I prefer the TW timer because in my opinion it gives a bit better performance in all driving conditions - especially at higher speed hill climbs. The one thing you have to do is clean the carbon dust from the timer at least once a year. At 1500 miles I find that you have to replace the carbon brush. As the brush wears you loose spring pressure against the tip. There is a trade off between performance and reliability with the TW. If I was driving across the country, I would use an ANCO. But for driving about 1,000 to 1,500 miles per year. I find the TW to be best for touring and normal driving around town.

When I first bought the coupe in 1976 I used a roller timer but I had lots of mis-firing. It was suggested I try a Tiger timer which uses a carbon brush on a vertical surface. It was much improved. I now realize that the front cover was not aligned correctly, live and learn. Then I went to a ole used distributor as I was tired of the constant maintenance of the commutator. Eventually the distributor wore out and I replaced it with an E-timer. Oh it’s so much better, almost worth the $400.
The speedster and 14 Touring have used new distributors since I restored them some twenty years ago. The 1909 Touring uses an “Two-piece” timer but so far it’s done zero miles.