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Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 11:49 am
by Been Here Before
Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Every so often the question is asked, "Any one know the whereabouts of this car?"
The a picture or maybe, if available a motor number ( 1 to 15176888)
I believe those from 1909-1-09 (1 to 14161) may be covered and found. see-
https://earlyfordregistry.com/
But all others are out there, some where.
A register could be useful by have owner provide a motor number, body style and current location. Owners name could be optional. The list could include motor numbers of engines as spares, trash, at least the production number has a geographical reference.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 11:57 am
by DHort
Privacy
Wish there was some kind of list like MTFCI used to do so you could find help while traveling.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 12:00 pm
by TWrenn
I think the name "earlyfordregistry" may be a bit misleading. From what little I've seen on their website, I haven't seen an actual "register" of the 14 thousand or so vehicles, of which there probably aren't 14 HUNDRED left! Likewise, for Model T's, what with over 15 MILLION produced, with the heretofor unanswered question as to how many are actually left, how is anyone going to be able to track 'em down to even put in some sort of a register, and who is gonna do the legwork?
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 12:09 pm
by Rich P. Bingham
Any registry would require continual maintenance, and would best be on a systematic updating by an organization such as MTFCA or perhaps a well endowed, established museum. Many owners likely feel the availability of such information would equate to an invasion of privacy. Whatever benefits a registry would provide, it would ever be voluntary and woefully incomplete. Perhaps I'm being unnecessarily negative - personally, I'm interested in the provenance of my own T, and would not be averse to signing on to a registry if one were initiated.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 12:13 pm
by Norman Kling
Almost every Model T still running is a combination of mis-matched parts. Either the number was ground off and a different one stamped on, or the engine number on the engine was used to register the car which was not actually the car on which the number was stamped. Also many of the body parts and transmission and other parts have been swapped for those from other years. Only an expert knows the difference. The average person we see while driving or showing the cars don't even know what year our car is, and some don't even know it is a Model T. Speedsters have been made with many aftermarket or home made or modified bodies. Only a T engine block is required to be considered a Model T speedster. Other cars have been modified with V8 or other engines or bodies from T's placed on other chassis. So there would only be a few out of all those still on the road which are completely original, and even those have had fenders replaced and almost all have been re-painted and new tops and tires etc.
Norm
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 12:28 pm
by John kuehn
Wondering why there isn’t a Model T Register is just like wondering what happened to all of Leon Parker’s wood plans and wondering why they haven’t been made public. It will never happen.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 12:55 pm
by BobUkPipedream
There is:
https://modeltregister.co.uk/
Now list of cars, well we have a members list.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 2:41 pm
by ModelTWoods
The number of Model T's, still around, both restored, unrestored, and parts cars (not exactly a low production vehicle over a period of 18 years); privacy of ownership: and as Mr. Rich Bingham mentioned, any registry would require constant maintenance and updating. There are probably other reasons, but i believe these would be the top three.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 3:08 pm
by John kuehn
You’re right about there are many variables that would have to considered. It would take lots of time and research to get it anywhere close to being accurate and would require owners to let the Register know about any changes in ownership or restoration done to their cars. In this day and time privacy has become a big issue.
By the time if it was ever compiled it would be out of date.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 3:41 pm
by Been Here Before
Granted trying to track over 15 million Model Ts, from 1908 to 1927 may seen daunting, but we all know that the total number in 2023/24 is far less than 15 million.
The number of folks on this forum and related Motel T forums, probable own a small percentage of the original production.
To say that it would be difficult is ...not realistic. Most forum members already have given up privacy by stating they own a TT, or roadster, or a restoration in progress. Where is the privacy ? So what is the problem with listing year, body type, motor number, and geographic location? Owners name is an option.
Also no one is asking all members or owners to divulge information. And of those who show or exhibit their car have given up privacy. Isn't there a section for a photo already on line?
Granted a register will not list all cars or even a pipe of pieced with a factory number. Not every one is a member of this or related forums or clubs.
But if there was a register, those cars that have been on the forum at some point can be followed.
And to say the logistic of tracking would be difficult, has any one looked at the list of principals? Certainly a register keeper is not out of the question. The group has a cat for Henry's Sake!
Officers of the MTFCA
President
Vice-President
Treasurer
Secretary
Executive Director
Directors
Chapter Newsletters
Chapter Websites
The Vintage Ford Editor
MTFCA Web Site
Chapter Coordinator
Youth Coordinator
Foreign Ambassador
Speedster/Racer Hall of Fame
Model T Museum Staff
Associate Museum Director
Lead Docent & Researcher
Museum Cat
Henry Ford
765-488-0026
MTFCA Staff
Finance and Office Manager
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 4:09 pm
by ModelTWoods
Granted, the number of Model T's still around in any condition, from a parts vehicle to a museum piece, are far less than the total number produced originally, I would be willing to bet that, worldwide, there are probably as many owned by non-club members, as there are by club members. Club members may not seek privacy or animosity for their cars, but I personally know of one restored 26-27 Touring owned by a non-member who has no intention of joining and another member who has probably 20, if not more, parts cars in the field around his house.
Been Here Before wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 3:41 pm
Granted trying to track over 15 million Model Ts, from 1908 to 1927 may seen daunting, but we all know that the total number in 2023/24 is far less than 15 million.
The number of folks on this forum and related Motel T forums, probable own a small percentage of the original production.
To say that it would be difficult is ...not realistic. Most forum members already have given up privacy by stating they own a TT, or roadster, or a restoration in progress. Where is the privacy ? So what is the problem with listing year, body type, motor number, and geographic location? Owners name is an option.
Also no one is asking all members or owners to divulge information. And of those who show or exhibit their car have given up privacy. Isn't there a section for a photo already on line?
Granted a register will not list all cars or even a pipe of pieced with a factory number. Not every one is a member of this or related forums or clubs.
But if there was a register, those cars that have been on the forum at some point can be followed.
And to say the logistic of tracking would be difficult, has any one looked at the list of principals? Certainly a register keeper is not out of the question. The group has a cat for Henry's Sake!
Officers of the MTFCA
President
Vice-President
Treasurer
Secretary
Executive Director
Directors
Chapter Newsletters
Chapter Websites
The Vintage Ford Editor
MTFCA Web Site
Chapter Coordinator
Youth Coordinator
Foreign Ambassador
Speedster/Racer Hall of Fame
Model T Museum Staff
Associate Museum Director
Lead Docent & Researcher
Museum Cat
Henry Ford
765-488-0026
MTFCA Staff
Finance and Office Manager
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 5:00 pm
by Been Here Before
Well, this is going no were.
This car was last seen on the MTFCA website....
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/257047/288571.html
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 6:07 pm
by George Mills
As pointed out, MTFCI use to do a registry program every few years or so. No serial numbers, but everything else an owner wanted to disclose. You had to get a hold of a lister to get that level stuff.
Was done by a third party publisher, the registry booklets [revised on advice of Dave H.] were hard bound [mine is, black leatherette of course, maybe Dave H is someones copy], and you had to buy them from the publisher. I think MTFCI got a 'cut' of the sales but not sure.
The publisher sent out cards to be filled out, you sent them back whether you bought a book or not. The publisher then had listings by alphabetical, then again by state [down to the city level I think?], and then again by year and model type.
For me, I found that I used the book maybe 6 or 7 times and still decided the cost of the book was worth it. I actually still have what I think was the last one done a few decades ago in my Model T book pile
Maybe a topic for the Board to think about...but for some reason I fear folks are more weary of having data out there today than they were in snail-mail days.
Pic's ...was actually a nice book-let. Added for ref...includes the publisher
- image2.jpeg (21.94 KiB) Viewed 2971 times
- image1.jpeg (22.76 KiB) Viewed 2971 times
- image3.jpeg (34.57 KiB) Viewed 2971 times
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 6:31 pm
by DHort
George Drobnock
Out of our club of about 40 members, I think 4-5 read the forum and that is it.
Young people are on FB and do not look here.
George Hill
I have an old MTFCI registry and it is not a book. I want to say it is about 4" x 6"
and in pamphlet form with staples in the middle. Has about 30-40 pages.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sat Nov 11, 2023 7:01 pm
by TRDxB2
Been Here Before wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 11:49 am
Why isn't there a Model T Register?
The answer to the question "Why isn't there a Model T Register?" is reflected in the question itself. Not enough T' owners know about its existance or even where to go to register
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 2:06 am
by DHort
The MTFCA could use their database to print out a list or just post it on here. All you have to do is check a box on your renewal and you will be added to the list. Unfortunately, this would only work for people that pay dues.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 9:38 am
by Chris Barker
I would just like to point out that here in the UK there is a Model T Ford Register - in fact that is the name of the Model T Club here.
One of the founders' aims 63 years ago was to find and record the details of surviving Ts in the UK. I think we have about 1200 known now, about half were Manchester-built; the others are cars and trucks imported, mostly from the US, in recent years.
Of course, doing the same in the USA would be a task on a very different scale.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 10:07 am
by Been Here Before
As the records at the Henry Ford for 1922 are destroyed, I tried to create a list of 1922 Ford Coupes surviving with Briggs manufactured bodies. The intent was to have a current geographical location, motor number and a matching Briggs body number for 1922 coupes. The results were maybe five parties that sent that information. Can share later. It was a start. The owners names, if shared were not of the listing once posted on the forum.
So a register of current surviving model Ts showing body number, motor number, body style/modification, and geographic location is not too arduous. And if the statistics are correct that is a few percent of 15 million plus.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 12:33 pm
by TRDxB2
TRDxB2 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 7:01 pm
Been Here Before wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 11:49 am
Why isn't there a Model T Register?
The answer to the question "Why isn't there a Model T Register?" is reflected in the question itself. Not enough T' owners know about its existance or even where to go to register
Per may statement - How many of you have added a picture of your vehicle to the Forum's Gallery or were aware of it?
app.php/gallery/album/4. While its not a "registry" it is something that requires owner participation.
Re: Why isn't there a Model T Register?
Posted: Sun Nov 12, 2023 5:48 pm
by jiminbartow
I proposed this in 2010 (
Www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/13 ... 1272492272). I even posted my information to try and get it started and to show everyone there was no danger in posting the information, but nothing ever came of it. Back then, for some reason, members did not want to give out their information. I thought the hobby would benefit tremendously from a Model T registry and I still do, but everyone has to willingly participate for it to become a reality. Jim Patrick