Clutch/hogshead assemble
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Topic author - Posts: 415
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:01 pm
- First Name: Michael
- Last Name: Deichmann
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring, 1921 Roadster P/U, 1922 Fordor (danish custom body)
- Location: Rågeleje, Denmark
- MTFCA Number: 29116
- Board Member Since: 2007
Clutch/hogshead assemble
Hi,
when mounting the hogshead, one of the challenges is to get the bronze fork (clutch release bearing) into the right groove in the clutch release device (C on below drawing). Now there are two grooves and the bronze fork can easily go in both, but which one is the right?
I believe it is the lower/inner groove as I have now two cars with it in the upper/outer groove with malfunctioning clutches and excessive axial play in the clutch axle in the hogshead (½" / 10-12 mm).
Before I spend some time trying to fix it, I just want to be sure.
The lower/inner groove is the right?
when mounting the hogshead, one of the challenges is to get the bronze fork (clutch release bearing) into the right groove in the clutch release device (C on below drawing). Now there are two grooves and the bronze fork can easily go in both, but which one is the right?
I believe it is the lower/inner groove as I have now two cars with it in the upper/outer groove with malfunctioning clutches and excessive axial play in the clutch axle in the hogshead (½" / 10-12 mm).
Before I spend some time trying to fix it, I just want to be sure.
The lower/inner groove is the right?
Ford Model T 1914 Touring
Ford Model T 1921 Roadster Pick-up
Ford Model T 1922 Fordor (danish build body)
ECCT, Strobospark, HCCT(Sold), Rebuilding coils
Ford Model T 1921 Roadster Pick-up
Ford Model T 1922 Fordor (danish build body)
ECCT, Strobospark, HCCT(Sold), Rebuilding coils
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- Posts: 1302
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:42 pm
- First Name: Frank
- Last Name: van Ekeren
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1916 touring, 1916 pick-up, 1924 coupe, 1926 touring, 1927 touring
- Location: Rosedale Vic Australia
Re: Clutch/hogshead assemble
The one closest to the spring.
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Topic author - Posts: 415
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:01 pm
- First Name: Michael
- Last Name: Deichmann
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring, 1921 Roadster P/U, 1922 Fordor (danish custom body)
- Location: Rågeleje, Denmark
- MTFCA Number: 29116
- Board Member Since: 2007
Re: Clutch/hogshead assemble
OK, then both are correct, but why can the clutch axle move axially ½"? Isn't that somewhat excssive?
Ford Model T 1914 Touring
Ford Model T 1921 Roadster Pick-up
Ford Model T 1922 Fordor (danish build body)
ECCT, Strobospark, HCCT(Sold), Rebuilding coils
Ford Model T 1921 Roadster Pick-up
Ford Model T 1922 Fordor (danish build body)
ECCT, Strobospark, HCCT(Sold), Rebuilding coils
-
- Posts: 1302
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:42 pm
- First Name: Frank
- Last Name: van Ekeren
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1916 touring, 1916 pick-up, 1924 coupe, 1926 touring, 1927 touring
- Location: Rosedale Vic Australia
Re: Clutch/hogshead assemble
Just checked a good working one, rocking the high/low pedal I'm getting about 1/4" play in the clutch finger shaft.
Check to make sure that the clutch forks are not loose on the shaft, they are a tight fit with pins through and peened both ends.
The bronze fork should be nearly as wide as the track in the release.
Check to make sure that the clutch forks are not loose on the shaft, they are a tight fit with pins through and peened both ends.
The bronze fork should be nearly as wide as the track in the release.
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Topic author - Posts: 415
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:01 pm
- First Name: Michael
- Last Name: Deichmann
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring, 1921 Roadster P/U, 1922 Fordor (danish custom body)
- Location: Rågeleje, Denmark
- MTFCA Number: 29116
- Board Member Since: 2007
Re: Clutch/hogshead assemble
I just made a small video of both cars so you can see the axial play I'm talking about:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfTBeDu ... e=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfTBeDu ... e=youtu.be
Ford Model T 1914 Touring
Ford Model T 1921 Roadster Pick-up
Ford Model T 1922 Fordor (danish build body)
ECCT, Strobospark, HCCT(Sold), Rebuilding coils
Ford Model T 1921 Roadster Pick-up
Ford Model T 1922 Fordor (danish build body)
ECCT, Strobospark, HCCT(Sold), Rebuilding coils
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- Posts: 3923
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- First Name: John
- Last Name: Kuehn
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- Location: Texas
- MTFCA Number: 28924
Re: Clutch/hogshead assemble
On pages 133-134 of the Model T Ford service manual there is a clear picture (fig. 305) which shows the installation of the clutch release ring into the rear groove on the clutch shift. It’s the one nearest the clutch spring.
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- First Name: Tony
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Re: Clutch/hogshead assemble
That axial play seems to be more that I generally see. Judging by the wear pattern on the pedal shaft it doesn’t seem to cause any problems.
I guess the only thing that limits the axial play is the location of the brass horseshoe shaped release fork and the play between the fork and the two arms on the clutch shaft. If the arms are tight on the clutch shaft I guess there is not much more you can do.
The brass fork goes into the slot nearest the spring, the one towards the rear of the transmission.
My recommendation is that it works, ignore it. Otherwise you’re in for a lot of work for little or no return.
I guess the only thing that limits the axial play is the location of the brass horseshoe shaped release fork and the play between the fork and the two arms on the clutch shaft. If the arms are tight on the clutch shaft I guess there is not much more you can do.
The brass fork goes into the slot nearest the spring, the one towards the rear of the transmission.
My recommendation is that it works, ignore it. Otherwise you’re in for a lot of work for little or no return.
Tony Bowker
La Mesa, California
1914 Touring, 1915 Speedster, 1924 Coupe.
La Mesa, California
1914 Touring, 1915 Speedster, 1924 Coupe.
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Topic author - Posts: 415
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:01 pm
- First Name: Michael
- Last Name: Deichmann
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Touring, 1921 Roadster P/U, 1922 Fordor (danish custom body)
- Location: Rågeleje, Denmark
- MTFCA Number: 29116
- Board Member Since: 2007
Re: Clutch/hogshead assemble
Thank you all for the replies.
Good that I asked before I dismantled the hogshead as my assembly turns out to be OK.
Regarding the "Taxi" I think it is a matter of adjusting the link between the pedal and the clutch axle. I have replaced the old clutch with a new (both rabbit type) and it is considerably thicker than the old - so adjustment should be expected.
Regarding the Pick-up I'm back to square one. The symptoms is, that as I press the gearpedal for neutral or low, it suddenly releases and go into high. I am out of ideas what that could be and have only had the inspection lid off and there is nothing to see.
Now I will assemble the Taxi and get it out of the shop to make room for the pick-up.
Good that I asked before I dismantled the hogshead as my assembly turns out to be OK.
Regarding the "Taxi" I think it is a matter of adjusting the link between the pedal and the clutch axle. I have replaced the old clutch with a new (both rabbit type) and it is considerably thicker than the old - so adjustment should be expected.
Regarding the Pick-up I'm back to square one. The symptoms is, that as I press the gearpedal for neutral or low, it suddenly releases and go into high. I am out of ideas what that could be and have only had the inspection lid off and there is nothing to see.
Now I will assemble the Taxi and get it out of the shop to make room for the pick-up.
Ford Model T 1914 Touring
Ford Model T 1921 Roadster Pick-up
Ford Model T 1922 Fordor (danish build body)
ECCT, Strobospark, HCCT(Sold), Rebuilding coils
Ford Model T 1921 Roadster Pick-up
Ford Model T 1922 Fordor (danish build body)
ECCT, Strobospark, HCCT(Sold), Rebuilding coils