Hand Crank Starting a Model T on the Magneto

[Ron Patterson]

Twenty-five years ago I posted an article on the subject above.
If anyone is interested in this subject today, let me know and I will post it again?
Ron Patterson

[Poppie]

Go for it Ron, the truth of information will not hurt anyone and help the new "T" ers ....n

[Rick_Rice]

Ron,
I would love to see this information from you!
Kind Regards,
Rick Rice

[Dennis_Brown]

Please post it. My ring gear is bad in 2 places and when I get ready to run it again I can use all the help available to start it.

[George House]

Yes ! Please post it Ron… 4 of my 5 T s run great on magneto and they have your restored coils but I’ve never been successful cranking them on mag.

[varmint]

Please post. I started our T this weekend by hand cranking it on BAT. I have yet to try on magneto.

[Ron Patterson]

Here you go.
Read them in the order below. The Fun Project link in the second one is broken.

Model T Ignition System-Final Article.pdf

(388.82 KiB) Downloaded 223 times

Hand Crank Starting the Model T Ford Car on Magneto-.docx

(460 KiB) Downloaded 274 times

Ron Patterson

[Art M]

Ron,
My car has always hand started on mag. Please tell me what I did to enable this when I rebuilt the engine and adjusted the coils. I have no idea if the trick is in the mag or is in the coil setting.

My low budget forced me to charge the magnets with number 12 house wire rather than to use a regular magnet charging unit. In the past, I have adjusted the coils with 3 'D' cell flashlight batteries. Now i use professionally adjusted coils.

Art Mirtes

[Art M]

Ron,
You posted the above while I was typing my above reply.

Art Mirtes

[PSJ]

Thank you Ron!

[Steve Jelf]

Some folks don't understand how easy it is to hand-start a T (on BAT OR MAG) because they have never tried it with one that is up to specs. A common mistake people make is to assume that their car is as it should be. Even infested with "upgrades", a Model T should be easy to start.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5ycpdfIjDo

[Ron Patterson]

To quote John Regan; the car is over 100 years old and a hundred people have been working on it.
What are the chances they all knew what they were doing?

[jab35]

Ron:
Thanks for sharing. Do you by chance have a copy of the "Huff, Ford and the Flywheel Magneto" (Vol 31, #2 Mar-Apr 1996 VF) which is referenced in your article, that you could share? Thanks, best regards, jb

[NealW]

Some folks don't understand how easy it is to hand-start a T (on BAT OR MAG) because they have never tried it with one that is up to specs. A common mistake people make is to assume that their car is as it should be.

Magnets, magneto gap and crankshaft endplay within the Ford Manual specs really make a difference with hand starting a T on magneto setting. One that is within specs is really easy to start by hand using the magneto.

[Ron Patterson]

The Model T Ford ignition system is compromised of many sub-systems. Those sub-systens are: the magneto, the magneto output hogshead termnal, all the magneto output wiring to the dash switch, the dash switch, all the switch to coilbox wiring, all the coilbox internal electrical connections, the ignition coils, all the wiring from the coilbox to the Timer, the Timer, all the wires from the coilbox to the spark plugs, the spark plugs, the spark lever steering column pull lever and the hand operating the spark lever, and the pull rod rod to the Timer, the correct setting of initial timing, the vehicle operator correctly manipulating each of these sub-systems and following the recommended instructions for hand crank starting of the car.
I have repaired trouble in each of these areas and found if any one of these elements are in disrepair the ignition system will not work as intended and hence hand crank starting of the Model T Ford car will not work.
Ron Patterson.

[Russ T Fender]

I had been driving my ‘10 Touring for years and never even considered starting it on mag. It came with a battery and I just assumed that was how it was supposed to be. One day I stalled at a busy intersection, panicked, I jumped out, pulled up on the crank and the car started right up. I got back in and went to switch from battery to mag when I realized it was already on mag and that I had not full retarded the spark when I pushed the lever up in my haste to get going again. I had inadvertently set myself up for a successful start on mag. I still use the battery to start but every now and then I start on mag just to prove I can still do it.

[ewdysar]

I have found that starting my '14 cold is pretty difficult to do on mag. It is a little better on Battery. Once she's warmed up, mag starts are easy. That said, I've never gotten a "free start" on mag.

Keep crankin',
Eric

[Ron Patterson]

Eric
Are you manipulating the carburetor mixture control as required for cold starting?
Ron Patterson

[Ron Patterson]

In my post above about prerequisites for hand crank starting on magneto I neglected to mention the required carburetor mixture manipulation requirement.
As a side note; many folks who post here generally think Model T starting carburetor mixture adjustment (and hot air pipe) is not important under any conditions. I disagree.
I can think of US geographical locations where that may be true, but generally Model T cold engine starting is much better accompolished with mixture control manipuation.
I will probably regret this comment?
Ron Patterson

[RajoRacer]

You are 100% correct, Ron - most T guys won't or are scared to fiddle with the mixture !

[ewdysar]

generally Model T cold engine starting is much better accomplished with mixture control manipulation.

most T guys won't or are scared to fiddle with the mixture !

OK, just for the record, it's not that I'm afraid, but spending my first half a century of messing about with T's in SoCal, I found that I usually did more harm than good by fiddling with the mixture. Once I got it dialed in, I would use only the choke to get the car running and warmed up a bit and everything was good.

After recently migrating north, I find that there is plenty I don't know about weather and seasons and how they affect all sorts of things, including my Ts. So I am ready for enlightenment, for I know that there are so many things that I don't know. How should I manipulate my mixture knob? Pay it a compliment? Offer a bribe? Berate it soundly? Or is there a "rule of thumb" that might get me into the right neighborhood so that I can figure out what might work best for my particular setup (since we all know that Ford built 15 million unique vehicles with independent personalities, or maybe the last 100 years of owners/mechanics has made each of them "special").

And for extra credit, does anyone know if Scott Conger's full flow float valve would change the cold start process at all (not that I have one yet, but maybe soon...)

Keep crankin',
Eric

[RajoRacer]

I open my cold engine 1/4 turn "rich" (CCW) then begin close it down upon warm up. Once you're up to operating temperature, a quick throttle jab will let you know if you're too lean - she'll stutter !

[TXGOAT2]

A good place to learn the basics of using the Ford controls is the Ford owner's manual.

[WillyR]

ohh crap, another skill I need to master....

I have helped a member start his 14 a couple times to say I did it, but I really should learn to crank start mine for emergency porpoises.

[Steve Jelf]

...but I really should learn to crank start mine for emergency porpoises.

Like most other Model T chores, it ain't rocket surgery. In fact, before 1919 hand starting is the only way without extra expenses. With a stock Model T in good shape, STARTING BY HAND SHOULD BE EASY. Videos by Mitch Taylor and others show how. This is important: https://dauntlessgeezer.com/DG101.html

Here's a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5ycpdfIjDo

[WillyR]

...but I really should learn to crank start mine for emergency porpoises.

Like most other Model T chores, it ain't rocket surgery. In fact, before 1919 hand starting is the only way without extra expenses. With a stock Model T in good shape, STARTING BY HAND SHOULD BE EASY. Videos by Mitch Taylor and others show how. This is important: https://dauntlessgeezer.com/DG101.html

Here's a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5ycpdfIjDo

in the way back days before smart phones I rode motorcycles and I had them so well tuned I could kick start them seated by hand....

[dykker5502]

Hand cranking or rather, the fact that it would not start on magneto was what get me down the endavour of rebuilding coils!

I had jumpstarted my Model T at home and drived 10 km (6 miles) and assumed that the generator may have charged the battery a little (it was completely flat when I jumpstarted). Unfortunately not enough to even activate the coils, so I pushed my luck and tried starting on magneto. No luck, so I borrowed a set of jumpstart cables and a friandly by standers car and battery and got it going.
There I decided to get my T to start on magneto, studied what there was (thank you Ron) to understand how it works and the rest is history.