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Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 12:31 pm
by GG Gregory
I just installed a nice old stock New Day on my 27 Roadster. I wired it according to the instructions that came with the wiring harness but the color code is totally off from what's marked on the New Day. I believe I have the piston travel correct by watching through the spark plug hole and using a straw but as I turn the timer the coil starts buzzing long before I get to full retard. And the wrong coil is buzzing. Am I getting something dead wrong or should I color match the wires per the New Day marked code ?

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 12:43 pm
by brucesp
Yes, the wire colors should match the New Day labels. Then double-check your timing using the through-the-hole method you mentioned. The New Day may require bending the rod some. Once you get it right, there's nothing like a New Day. Besides being really reliable, the inter-cylinder timing accuracy is the best of the bunch.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 12:46 pm
by Steve Jelf
That yellow tracer makes me suspicious of the harness. Sometimes the new ones are made incorrectly.

TIMER.jpg
TIMER.jpg (63.67 KiB) Viewed 1549 times
Connect your timer like this, even if the colors on your harness disagree. Black on the timer terminal goes to #1 on the coil box, red terminal to #2, etc.


Set timing like this: http://dauntlessgeezer.com/DG97.html


IMG_4430 copy.JPG
Be sure the timer control rod doesn't touch the top terminal.

IMG_4434 copy.JPG
I added an extra cotter pin to keep the rod away from that terminal screw.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 1:30 pm
by John kuehn
Some of the reproduction wiring harnesses aren’t always correct color wise. Wire up the timer one wire at a time following the coil box 1 2 3 4 and disregard the color. You can’t go wrong doing it this way. I have 2 timer wire harnesses with a mismatched wire and that was the problem. Use the diagram as Steve has posted and you should be OK.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 1:56 pm
by otrcman
"I believe I have the piston travel correct by watching through the spark plug hole and using a straw ..."

There is one trap that you can bite you when looking at piston position. (Don't ask me how I know.) The piston comes up to TDC twice per cycle. If you set the timing on the wrong stroke, your timing will be 180 degrees off. You need to be certain that you are looking at piston position on the compression stroke.

To ensure you are on the compression stroke, you just about need two people. One person places a finger over the open spark plug hole while a second person turns the crank. When person #1 feels air trying to escape past his finger, he tells person #2 to stop turning. At that point, you can insert the straw and work the engine back and forth a bit to find exact TDC.

I'm not saying that this is the only thing that can go wrong, but it's one that definitely needs to be eliminated.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:57 pm
by GG Gregory
Thanks everyone..especially Steve Jelf for his diagram. Ok, I got the correct coil to buzz just before full regard but if I pull the spark rod all the way down I get buzzing from #2 coil. I know this isn't right !

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:01 pm
by GG Gregory
Forgot to mention I have all rebuilt coils installed also.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:42 pm
by John kuehn
I have to ask what kind of timer were you using before changed to the New Day. I have two T’s that have NewDay timers and when changing from roller timers to New Day timers I just changed out to the New Days and that was it. I really didn’t try to re time the cars.
And yes there is a LOT mentioned in past posts about about the importance of correct timing but when the spark rod is retarded and the correct wiring procedure is used that’s about all there is to it.
Make sure the timer connections are not hitting the spark rod when advancing the timer. That can happen.
I read in a 2012 post from a poster who made a lot of sense when he said that timing a T is essentially the same for most timers. The issues arise when installing them and forgetting a step or leaving it out and issues arise. Been there and done that myself.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:06 pm
by Steve Jelf
No straw needed, and I have no trouble finding compression on #1. I put a thumb over the spark plug hole and pull up on the crank until I feel air squirting out. At that point I stop pulling. This happens well before TDC. Then I watch the pin position and follow the instructions in the link.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:14 pm
by GG Gregory
John
It had a original Ford roller timer, but it was pretty much used up. Steve, I followed you instructions.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:53 pm
by rickg
Gary, I have the timing tool that is made by TW Timers and you are welcome to use it, I am in Farragut just off the Pellissippi Pkw. it is a great tool to set the timing.I have the bending tools also, the Ford timer settings are different so you may be off.

Rick

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:12 pm
by Susanne
TDC - put a chopstick in the #1 cyliner to find #1 TDC.Check your timer - its either on TDC or 180 off. Then pop the head and look at the valves - if #1 both valves are seaterd you got it.

Otherwise you are (likely) 180 degrees off. If so go to the NEXT #1 cylinder TDC and set your timing.

I=If a farmer in 1918 could figure it out, so can YOU,

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 6:41 pm
by GG Gregory
I think I have it now...I was 180° off. Thanks Rick for the offer of the tools ! Since we live so close maybe we'll meet up sometime.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:58 pm
by Norman Kling
Only problem I see in the picture by Steve, is the cotter pin. I would face it in the opposite direction so it won't come in contact with the fan belt when you advance the spark as far as the rod will allow. I would also put the wire above the rod as in the picture by Gregory. If you bend the tab just right, you won't contact the timer rod.
I have an old stock New Day timer on one of my T's and very rarely have to do anything to it. A very dependable timer.
Norm

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 10:56 am
by Original Smith
Who ever made you loom, didn't use the correct colors.

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 10:58 am
by Divcoone
Does the rod normally get that close to the belt, or is it too advanced?

Re: Timing with a New Day

Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 7:05 pm
by John kuehn
Here’s a pic of the timer rod belt clearance on my 21 T Touring with the New Day timer. On my car it was a little tricky getting the timer rod to clear under the lower radiator outlet but it worked out with a little tweaking.