MTFCA Forum

I'm about to replace the front spring, perches, shackles, etc on my 24 Touring and am wondering about this spring clip configuration on the car and whether it is stock.

All the forensic evidence points to this car as having been revived during WW2. What I believe they did was take a pretty much rust-free, thoroughly orginal (paint and all) 24 T Touring that had been wrecked (and recieved sheet metal damage on one side in the front as well as the radiator) and repaired it with either junkyard T parts or parts they had laying around from other T's.

Having been raised on and around farms, I recognize this sort of "look" as coming from a car/truck/tractor that has seen hard use but has always been stored inside. It's a unique look, but I've seen it several times over the years.

My question is about the front spring clip. I see that there's one in the middle that I've seen on the improved cars, then two outer ones that I've seen on earlier cars. Whatever was done here, was done a very long time ago, possibly at the same time all the other repairs were made.

I'm not restoring this car but rather returning it to the time in WW2 after all the repairs were made. So...if the current spring clip configuration isn't stock, but would still work well, I'll just replace the springs and put it back like it is.

Here’s another, higher resolution photo.

The two outer ones sort of look like rear spring clips.

Yes, your car is wearing some extra parts.

Steve Jelf wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:18 pm

Yes, your car is wearing some extra parts.

I wonder what their logic was.

Do you think the extra two could be to keep the car from leaning so much when they had it loaded down?

Maybe I'll get the springs out and discover that one of them is broken and they were using the other two clips to patch that problem.

The earlier T’s used a one piece wider bracket to clip the front spring to the front cross member. Maybe that’s why the 2 extra clamps were added to add more substantial bracing in their mind like the earlier ones were.
If that’s what was on their mind maybe they couldn’t find the earlier wider spring bracket and added the 2 extra ones to “make” one. After all the 2 are interchangeable.

It rides better with the single bracket, but given what I think you're doing with this car, it is an interesting oddity. When you get to it, you may a broken leaf or two and that may be the reason for the extra clamps.

As an aside, my grandmother used to tell me that during/post WWII, lots of T's hit the road again as purchasing tires for "newer" cars was all but impossible for a good while, and "T" tires were plentiful. Perhaps that is the genesis of your "resurection"...who knows?

Here is the setup used on the earlier cars.

What year did they switch?

An early taper leaf front spring also. It naturally belongs on a 1916 or earlier T, but as another piece of the car's history, maybe a taper leaf spring should still be there? It may be that whoever added the extra clamps was trying to compensate for the lighter spring?
There were six-hole castings sold after-market that were made to use both the '20 to '27 engine/spring mount and U-bolts in a similar fashion. They were supposed to stiffen and strengthen the front suspension (frankly they didn't really help that much), and mostly used on trucks of some sort. But that does not look like what you have.

If you removed the 2 extra clamps you would have the original set up for your car. The one in the center. The earlier and wider set up that Steve Jeff posted was used up to early 22 but maybe earlier. Others would know for sure. Someone added the extra clamps to make it a little better in their mind.

I’ll be interested to see what it all looks like as it cones apart.

The bushings in the perches are worn all the way through, into the perches themselves. So...they’re getting replaced.

The spring bushing on the driver’s side was worn all the way through and has cut away part of the spring eye, so I just went ahead and ordered a complete new front spring set. It should be here next week. Once finished, I’ll have a very nice front suspension.

I’m leaning (pun intended) toward not reinstalling the two extra clips. The T has seen the last of its heavy farm work and I’d prefer a softer ride. But, I’ll hold off on the decision until I put eyes on all of it disassembled.

Last year, I disassembled, cleaned, slip-painted and reinstalled the rear spring and installed new perches and bushings and wow...what a difference.

The front spring is in even worse shape. The side with the most wear, is worn so badly that the spring eye is actually sitting on top of the axle. So...I have zero suspension travel on that side. And, it’s evident when I go over bumps.

I’m anxious to see what the little car feels like with both front and rear suspensions at 100%.

Scott_Conger wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:41 pm

As an aside, my grandmother used to tell me that during/post WWII, lots of T's hit the road again as purchasing tires for "newer" cars was all but impossible for a good while, and "T" tires were plentiful. Perhaps that is the genesis of your "resurection"...who knows?

Could very well be what happened.

I’ve talked to a guy who was a young teenager in Comanche, TX during the war and he does remember a farmer who resurrected a T because of the shortage of cars, and he thinks this is that T but he’s not sure. I have several bits of evidence that point to it be resurrected during that general time frame and one very specific piece of evidence that narrows it down to the WW2 years.

Have you replaced or checked out any or other bushings in the entire front axle assembly? If the spring perches are worn than probably all or most of the rest need to be checked or replaced. You may have already replaced some of them but if you haven’t now would be a good time to drop the front axle assembly, place it on the workbench and replace what’s needed. Once that’s all done you’ll be pleasantly surprised how much your front end response will be. In my experience when the spring perches are really worn the rest of the bushings are also.
Good luck.

John kuehn wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 7:39 pm

Have you replaced or checked out any or other bushings in the entire front axle assembly? If the spring perches are worn than probably all or most of the rest need to be checked or replaced. You may have already replaced some of them but if you haven’t now would be a good time to drop the front axle assembly, place it on the workbench and replace what’s needed. Once that’s all done you’ll be pleasantly surprised how much your front end response will be. In my experience when the spring perches are really worn the rest of the bushings are also.
Good luck.

Good advice John

I plan on inspecting and, if needed, replacing any bushing or moving part in the steering and front axle. I have new perches and bushings and a rebuilt lower steering bracket in my possession and have rebuilt spindles, steering arms and a spring set on the way. I’m guessing I probably need to have the axle reamed and bushed as well. The aforementioned will take care of quite a bit of the total moving parts but there will still be more that needs attention.

i think I read that is to prevent the front crossmember from cracking because the newer spring mounting is too flexible and it makes a stress point. I found this one on a chassis I bought years ago.