A Wake Up Call on How Times Are Changing....,

[Henry K. Lee]

and not in a good way. I went to the bank today to deposit a large amount cashiers check. It came from a respectful person that has bought from me in the past, good character, etc.The bank manager had to approve it for deposit..., WHAT? Because so many are frauds! Really! My bank knows me well but wants to protect all their clients. Cool.

So I did a little research just out of curiosity and found out some real startling facts. Here they are;

1) AI is such a security risk for banks and their clients, ie, cashiers checks are a door opening to a thief if they
get fully processed.
-Routing number/account number if processing is returned to origin.
2) They investigate the person on social platforms, ie, Facebook, etc check multiple selfies, videos, with voice etc.
-Upload into an AI data base which they use to drain your accounts.

Do not think bank transfers are save either, they could be a small fish going for a whale since you gave them two for free.

Old School business practices, personal check, photo ID, vehicle registration with all matching addresses. Take a photo of all or just bring CASH!


Be very careful folks, this was an eye opener for me as a trusting person. Thieves are looking for anyway to rip us off!

Happy Holidays!

Hank

[tdump]

It saddens me that the time has come that a check is questioned, money can be arrested and such.
If i want to buy a car from you and your are 4 states away. I put the cash in my pocket,gas up the truck and get 2 states from home,if i have more than 2 months income in my possession it can be arrested under civil forfeiture laws. I would be left on the side of the road with no money,no way to pay you,and legal fees almost always work out to within a few dollars of the amount they arrest, this is to insure they get to keep it because it cost to much to fight to prove it is innocent.
So to be honest, it is fast becoming difficult for us to do business at all without it being electronic,traceable and hackable. sorry for the thread drift but I prefer to deal in cash instead of checks and it is getting difficult and risky.

[1925 Touring]

New and improved isn't it?! I knew right from the start ever since I heard about AI also known as artificial idiots that this sort of stuff was going to happen. What do you think happens when a computer is working against you??

[TWrenn]

New and improved isn't it?! I knew right from the start ever since I heard about AI also known as artificial idiots that this sort of stuff was going to happen. What do you think happens when a computer is working against you??

Anyone maybe remember it was me who even pretty much made the first post of many to follow from others warning how DETRIMENTAL this AI crap is gonna be to the world?. And it's already rolling out of control. Likewise, I view this as also a Segway for government(s) to put their digital dollar program in place. They'll claim it'll "protect us" from fraud. I say BULL---t!

[Wayne Sheldon]

A long time ago, in middle school, I read one of my favorite of all time books. A couple times, when allowed, I did book reports on it when I was in high school. I have quoted from it often. Many times using it as a guide in conversations.
The book? 1984.

I still believe that George Orwell was trying to warn us. Unfortunately, while hundreds of millions of people ignored the warnings? A few thousand elitists used the book as a blueprint.
It was a little behind Orwell's prediction, but we essentially reached the foundation of his predictions in the 1990s, and today, whether we can see it or not? We are fully there.
Abraham Lincoln's "Government of the people, by the people, and FOR the people" perished about thirty years ago. What we have had for well over twenty years now is "Government of the masses, by the chosen (people chosen to run in elections with any chance to win), for the select (the select few elitists that believe they have a right to own everything whether they earned it or not!)".
Most people fully believe everything the central media or government tells them, no matter how obvious the lies. History has been rewritten, and continues to be rewritten regularly to enforce political agendas. Language has lost its meaning! Few people under the age of fifty now even know which "their" Two" or "four" is the correct one? Words have been redefined to the point they have lost any meaning! And one of the worst of all, actual loss of ownership and property rights is seldom discussed, in spite of how blatant they have become.

People do not matter to this country anymore, and certainly their rights are mostly gone. AI is just the next step in the elitist's parade. The worst is yet to come.

[TXGOAT2]

The income tax ended citizenship and replaced citizens with subjects. It's been downhill ever since for Of, by, and for the People.
Read the Sixteenth Amendment and consider its implications... and observe the results.

[tdump]

The income tax ended citizenship and replaced citizens with subjects. It's been downhill ever since for Of, by, and for the People.
Read the Sixteenth Amendment and consider its implications... and observe the results.

Well, this was all decided long before i was riding a 58 Harley while in my momas belly! To late for me to ever see it fixed!

AMENDMENT XVI

Passed by Congress July 2, 1909. Ratified February 3, 1913.

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.

[TXGOAT2]

Carte blanche to loot and oppress and control.

[tdump]

"It's a bird", "it's a plane", no it's a drone coming down on YOU because you didn't pay your taxes!
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/th ... 1ae1&ei=73

[Norman Kling]

A few experiences which I have had in the past several years. When traveling, I used to take along travelers checks. When we went to Europe (before the Euro). I would take along a few dollars of the country I was visiting first. Before I crossed the border, so I could pay a taxi or bus to get me to the town I would be visiting. I also found out that I could use an ATM to draw out money in that country's currency. Which I used while there. Then would repeat the process by going to a bank and transferring to the money of the next country to be visited. The travelers checks were just a backup. Anyway, that worked about 30 years ago. In Canada, many times we could pay with U.S. money just converted it by exchange rate. Same thing in Mexico.
I don't leave the U.S.A. anymore but now we take along enough cash to get home, even if we have to drive straight through and rest at rest stops (haven't needed to do that yet). We use credit cards for rooms and meals and gas along our route. I take one credit card, my wife takes a different card, just in case we lose one (a couple times we were denied use of the card because we hadn't notified the bank we would be traveling). So we take cards for different banks and also ATM cards. She takes a different ATM card than I do. We do not use the ATM cards for anything except at ATM machines. We do not use debit cards for purchases. So far this system has worked for road trips or airline trips in the states.
Next, i will tell you about a problem we had when paying by check. I wrote a check for $60. I dropped it in a drive through mail box outside the post office at night after the mail had been picked up for the day. When I got my statement, I found that the amount had been changed to $6,000.00 and the pay to the order of name had been changed. My signature remained. The payee, hadn't received the check so I paid them in cash. As soon as I was aware of what had happened, I notified my credit union. They did an investigation, we changed the balance in the account to a new account. with new checks. I also notified the Sheriff and the Postal service. After a couple months, I was credited for the $6,000.00 (must have been insurance). So I now only deposit mail containing checks directly inside the lobby of the post office. And I also pick up my mail right after the mail is delivered.
Norm

[Loftfield]

What to do? Cashiers checks are nearly worthless, so easily forged. Cash has always been vulnerable, if not Bonnie and Clyde then confiscation by law enforcement to bolster their banks accounts. Personal checks are a joke. Recent purchases: a unique apple cider press direct from China, paid via PayPal. Antique car bought from individual: wire transfer, all danger of scam on me, not good enough.

Anybody tried buying a car via PayPal?

Of course we shouldn't be doing antique cars; pollutes the environment and no doubt disadvantages one or more sub-groups of the society. Just do what Big Brother says and all will be well. You guys quoting 1984 and Animal Farm are spot on. We are in really deep doo doo with no real idea how to get out.

[TXGOAT2]

I was able to buy a car from out of state, but there was a lot of back and forth between the two banks involved. I paid the transportation bill with a personal check.

[John Codman]

I do pretty much the same as Norman Kling. He's right about the credit cards. Discover shut down my wife's credit card while we were in Russia, despite the fact that she had notified them about our European trip. As to wire transfers - that is about the only form of payment that the transfer agent will accept if you purchase real estate.
As to income taxes - I don't like paying them any more then anyone else, but unless you want roads in the condition that they were when our Ts were new, and are prepared to learn another language when our shell of a military cannot defend us, the feds have to get the money from somewhere. If you have a better, more fair way of raising revenue, I would love to hear it.
As I have said on this forum before, if people would actually take the time to study the issues and vote for candidates who tell it as it is, rather then blindly voting for whoever tells us what we want to hear, we would have a far better government. As Pogo said "We have met the enemy and he is us."

[John kuehn]

I pretty much agree with the changing times aren’t that good. It’s getting here faster than lots of folks realize. It’s coming with the changing technologies and how our younger folks have accepted it as the only way to go. And in some ways it’s getting to be that way. Who we are, our personal information and all that comes with it is now for the world to see.

Pandora’s box has its lid wide open and what’s coming out in a furious pace is an information overload open to anybody to use for more bad than good. We haven’t seen anything yet.

[TXGOAT2]

Fuel taxes pay for roads.
Taxes are sky-high, and we have a "shell military"?

[TXGOAT2]

Legitimate federal functions, such as defense and a department of state, can be financed with import duties.
All other federal activities should cease.

[TXGOAT2]

The ODIOUS Sixteenth... !

[Gen3AntiqueAuto]

Fuel taxes pay for roads.
Taxes are sky-high, and we have a "shell military"?

you haven't come to MA - fuel taxes excise taxes - "eh, road's only 50 years old and hasn't reached 100% 3ft deep potholes yet - it's fine."

[John kuehn]

But we’re being told how great things are these days! And the last two years we’ve gotten so much better! The big guy is getting bigger and the little guy is getting smaller and the middle guys are getting squeezed to the limit. Is something wrong with this picture?

[TRDxB2]

Here is some things you may not have realized.

-Depositing Cashier Checks, Money orders etc are have been treated the same as Personal Checks for several years. The reason has to do to the quality of printers & copy machines to make fraudulent ones. Also, a stop payment can be made on any of them.
-Depositing $10,000 or more means your bank or credit union will report it to the federal government. The $10,000 threshold was created as part of the Bank Secrecy Act, passed by Congress in 1970, and adjusted with the Patriot Act in 2002.
-Credit Card payments can always be disputed. The user has roughly 60-120 days to make a claim depending on the reason.
-A wire transfer can also be recalled. A wire recall or a recall wire transfer, like a credit card chargeback, is a reversal of charges, but for a bank account rather than a credit card. A wire recall is more challenging to obtain than a credit card chargeback but can be done! https://mychargeback.com/our-services/b ... e-recalls/
-
Are Fuel Taxes actually used for road & highway improvements? Well it depends on the State. Currently Full EV vehicles don't pay a fuel tax for using the State's roads but many States are no adding a surcharge in their yearly registrations. https://reason.org/policy-brief/how-muc ... rom-roads/

[TXGOAT2]

Texas diverted fuel tax may go to DPS. I'd like to know for sure.

[John Codman]

Fuel taxes pay for roads.
Taxes are sky-high, and we have a "shell military"?

I did not say that we have a shell military. What I said, and after rereading my post I think that is clear, is that we have to pay for infrastructure and military somehow, and the money to pay for them (and a lot of other things) has to come from somewhere. It is true that most of the federal money spent on roads comes from fuel taxes, but most other Federal expenses are paid for by the income tax. My question was and still is, is if you want lower income taxes, how do you pay for Federal expenditures? What expenditures would you lower or eliminate? If you think our taxes are high, go to Europe - Denmark income taxes are in the 50% range. Gasoline is two or three times the cost of what it is here. We don't have it as badly as some think.

[speedytinc]

The we got it better than other European communist/socialist excuse doesnt make out situation OK.
Taking money from us at the point of a gun is not good no matter how you rationalize it.(try not paying what THEY think you owe)
Here our "road taxes" are stolen & used for other socialist whims, like enriching buddies in the homeless industrial complex. Here in the highest tax state not to mention ALL the extra, uncounted taxes disguised as FEES. & we still are not living in their socialist utopia. Just a little more money.
SOOooo much money is wasted/diverted to organizations to supposedly care for all the migrating zombie mental drug addicts from less climate friendly states. Used to be for all the illegals & their spawn. Sales taxes are raised to cover added infrastructure costs, like police, yet there is much less enforcement & our standard of living degrades. Certainly you all have followed California's death spiral. The taxpayers are leaving in droves as the tax takers move in & multiply. Be warned, it will spread to your States also whall you arent looking. Aint one party rule great?

[Distagon2]

I'm not the brightest star in the sky, but I think this thread is what one would call a "political posting."

[John Codman]

I'm not the brightest star in the sky, but I think this thread is what one would call a "political posting."

It's close, but people have been saying that the world is going to hell in a handbasket for centuries. I have lived in this wonderful country for about one-third of it's existence, and life is better now then it was when I was a child. Sure, their are a few things today that I don't like, but they are few and far between. Diseases that were a death sentence in the '50s are treatable now; anyone who has the common sense to be vaccinated against Polio doesn't have to worry about catching a disease that was almost 100% sure to leave you paralyzed or dead. Leukemia is treatable in most cases. Having your Appendix removed used to leave you with a barn-door scar and keep you in the hospital for a week; a few years ago a NASCAR driver had his Appendix removed on a Tuesday and started and finished a stock car race on Sunday. Food is better and easier to access, most of us who want it can have air conditioning, the air is cleaner, heating systems are more efficient, most of us are not worried about where our next meal is coming from. A really good education is available for most who want it (I paid my own way through college). My mother was sledding and was run over by a horse and wagon when she was a child - she lived to see humans walk on the Moon. I think we are doing pretty well.

[TXGOAT2]

We could be doing great deal better.

[John kuehn]

When you study World History for the last 4-5000 years you will find great empires have risen and fallen. The rise and fall of the Roman Empire, The conquests of Alexander the Great, nations that were defeated and enslaved. Tyrants taking over and slowly enslaving the masses. Bear in mind some countries lasted longer than others but eventually deteriorated from within. Other versions of the “new normal” began creeping in.
This country is nearing the threshold of change and the balance of World power is changing before our eyes. Meanwhile things are changing politically overseas.

In our eyes we hardly notice it but sooner and not later we will begin to notice it whether we want to or not. Or as the old saying goes “ what goes around comes around”.

[Henry K. Lee]

John, You nailed it! I have been preaching for years the same thing.

Hank

[tdump]

Alot of truth in the last 2 post.
Things could be better than they are.
In the 50's we didn't have such a suicide rate as we do now ,divorce rate was much lower.
As for the type of post this is, and some being concerned, it is past time that folks feel comfortable discussing the condition and future of our country

[John Codman]

To those who say that we could be doing better - I agree. The same thing could be said of any government. "Democracy is the worst form of government except for all the others" - a loose quote from Winston Churchill. I read somewhere that Australia is the only country in the world that gets more immigrants from the United States then it sends. We can't be doing too badly.

[George Mills]

I had a decent sized EFT get 'lost' in the system between two banks for close to 30 days! They call it security checking ...or...looking for money laundering... they kept sending it back and forth to each other...but...in the end they just sent it back to start...no explanation on my end, I got a phone call from the original guy apologizing. Now think...a bank system sits on YOUR money for 30 days...wanna bet they do some form of legal overnight banking international interbank on their 'hold accounts' deposits... and they keep the interest and fees all?

In the end they told me that I should take a regular ordinary 'check' and do an in person window deposit at the closest branch where I maintain accounts. I did...no issue...money was in account by the 3rd day...these new and seemingly ever changing bank rules are just almost too much.

[TXGOAT2]

It's getting really creepy out there.

[Norman Kling]

I don't know whether this has been mentioned, but inflation is a form of taxation. The government borrows much money and it is paid off in deflated dollars so that it is paid off for a worth less than what was borrowed, meanwhile, it puts the wage earner who gets "
cost of living" raises into a higher tax bracket so he gets a tax hike without even legislating. And the "value" of his home goes up so that when he sells it later he is taxed on "capital gains"
Norm

[John Codman]

I don't know whether this has been mentioned, but inflation is a form of taxation. The government borrows much money and it is paid off in deflated dollars so that it is paid off for a worth less than what was borrowed, meanwhile, it puts the wage earner who gets "
cost of living" raises into a higher tax bracket so he gets a tax hike without even legislating. And the "value" of his home goes up so that when he sells it later he is taxed on "capital gains"
Norm

If you sell your primary residence home you pay no income tax on the "profit" if you purchase another primary residence that is equal or greater in cost then what you received for the house that you sold. If the new house is of lesser cost, you pay a capital gains tax on only the portion of the capital gain that exceeds the difference in price of the two dwellings.
Frankly, I have heard a lot of complaining on this thread about how things are run in our country, but few suggestions as to how to fix the problem. When a politician says that he/she is going to "eliminate waste and corruption", You are looking at a politician that is telling you what you want to hear. Even with the best of intentions, a politician has a very difficult job in cutting expenses. The house and senate - Either at state level or in Washington operates on a barter system. "You support my bill to build a new school, and I'll support your bill for The new road that you want". Whether either is really needed is irrelevant - the politician wants to talk to his/her constituents about all of the jobs that were created.
When Boston's "Big dig" was being built there was a huge amount of "remediation" money paid out for loss of business or damage to property, including $18 million to a major national corporation that you would recognize instantly. The "remediation" was for the company's losing the use of three parking spaces for a couple of years while there was tunneling (cut and cover) going on nearby. We all paid for it.

[Craig Leach]

John C,
Good point. You mentioned Australia. Google immigrating to Australia & look up the requirements to immigrate there. Also Australia's immigration
limits the number of immigrants a year to less then come to the US every hour. I make a point of asking cashers if they take cash with out I.D.
Just to see the reaction I get. Socialism works great till you run out of other peoples money. Margret Thatcher.
Craig.

[TXGOAT2]

Waste. Graft. Profligate Crackpots. Neglect of proper government functions.

[Norman Kling]

I like it when one house of congress is one party and the other is the other party. Or the congress is different party from President. I also think each bill should cover one item, not a whole years budget in one bill. And I like it when the politicians represent their own districts rather than buying a whole " platform".
Norm

[Henry K. Lee]

I know this thread has drifted a bit but the second hidden message has surfaced by many..., "When the silent majority speaks load but the officials ignore their concerns, our future as one becomes divided. History repeats itself time and time again but some think we are too civilized. Civilized societies are all based on trust and when the trust is manipulated/broken/abused unrest begins with rebellious acts"!

Stating Facts,

Hank

[Wayne Sheldon]

"No nation, No business, no economy, built upon a foundation of lies, can long survive!"

The truth is, that lies have been with us ever since language was invented (about 50,000 years ago?). They have always been a big part of our politics, and our businesses. However, I have seen lying becoming more common everywhere I look, and more acceptable to most people I meet, than I think they have ever been.

No country or economy can long survive if it consumes more than it produces.

Our country is in serious trouble. On both accounts.

[TXGOAT2]

Some persons make a profession of lying and otherwise taking advantage of others. They're not all unscrupulous used car sales people, either. Many of these people are attracted to positions of authority. Some of these persons spend decades in public office, in spite of the fact that, in the USA, We, The People, have lawful means at hand to remove them. We Americans don't seem to be much inclined to exercise our power to defend ourselves from malfeasant officials effectively. The toxic results of that are everywhere to be seen.

[Norman Kling]

One problem with the current tax structure, is that it is set up to tax over and over the same money! Income tax when it is earned or obtained through investments. Then sales tax when it is spent and if spent on anything of lasting value property tax which is repeated annually and even assessed with inflation and the tax raised. Then capital gains tax when it is sold.

However, some things could be a lot worse, which I remember as a young boy World war two. The speed limit was imposed even on major rural highways and gas was rationed to about 10 gallons per week, so you couldn't drive far. New tires not available so the recap became popular. Some people had more than one car and actually could get gas rations for both, some put their second cars up on stands for storage several years. New cars were not available and some food items were rationed. Many grew vegetable gardens and raised rabbits, chickens or pidgeons for eggs and meat. We had a goat for milk. Some stores had a limit on how much of a food item you could buy even if it was not rationed. There was even a housing shortage, because new houses were not being built. We had regular air raid drills and lights out. Etc Etc. Family members went in the military and some never got home. The school lost teachers because the men went into the military and the women moved to be near where their husbands were stationed if they were not overseas. One of my teacher's husband was on the Arizona which is now on the bottom of the sea at Peal Harbor, and she was on shore and saw the bombing. I saw his name on a plaque years later and actually shed a tear. We got through it though.
This centuary is much like the 20th except that the weapons and communications are much improved now which could be a blessing or a curse, depending how they are used.
Norm

[John Codman]

This is Ford-related and demonstrative of political speak. From a 1954 Ford Times Magazine: A Ford sedan was being compared to a similar Russian car in Europe. The tests were acceleration, top speed, hill climbing, fuel economy, and (as I recall) handling. The Ford easily won them all. When the results were published in Russia it read: "The Russian car (I don't recall the car's name) finished second, the American Ford finished next to last."

[TXGOAT2]

We're getting there.

[John kuehn]

Yes it’s coming. The time will come when 2+2= 5 will be considered correct and you’ll be considered an idiot if you don’t believe it.

[A Whiteman]

Cheques (checks) personal and otherwise? These are historical documents now in New Zealand, they have not been accepted here for a couple of years now. Guess what? Society is still 'clocking along' with out them.

[TXGOAT2]

Tyranny.

Carrot cake. \\ Duck food.

[Susanne]

Why all the political BS on a Model T site? Asking for all of us who are here for the hobby, and not a political discussion....

Seriously, I'm at the point of damned near leaving here because people are so sucked up into shoving THEIR politics down others throats that they effing FORGOT this is not a POLITICAL WEBSITE but one for our club.

It doesn't really matter if I'm a true conservative (EG Harding) or a liberal or a neutral or a Libertarian or a jagoff.... I'm here for the old car hobby. If you want to make this a POLITICAL DEBATE SOCIETY, then, the MTFCA isn't what I believed it was for the past FIFTY years....

WAKE UP CALL?? HERE'S YOURS... Some of us couldn't care less about YOUR political views... and when you bring your POLITICS here, you try to make our cool hobby into your little political wah wah game.

[NoelChico]

Nobody forces anybody to read every thread on the forum. If you don’t like the contents of a thread, don’t read it. I enjoy the discourse, even though I don’t agree with all of it.

[Distagon2]

Well, Susanne put it maybe a little strongly-but that is her right. I know folks are passionate about what is going on in the country, and that is a good thing. They care! However, I have seen other special interest forums turn into political discussion forums and miss the point of what the forum is meant for. Next thing you know, there are postings about who the biggest crook is, the Dem or the Repub. And the next post is about what a great job the current president is doing, and the next post is about what a crook he is, and on and on and on. After a while, you start losing the expertise who post here regularly as nobody cares to wade through the political stuff.

[Norman Kling]

If there is a topic on the forum I am not interested in, I just don't open it or if I did and I do not want to contribute,or continue reading, I just go to the bottom and click Return to General Discussion, and go on. Simple. I actually enjoy this thread, but do not care so much about some of the ones on modifications to Model T's, but Just move on. There is plenty of interest on here for all of us to enjoy, or ignore.
Norm

[tdump]

This is Ford-related and demonstrative of political speak. From a 1954 Ford Times Magazine: A Ford sedan was being compared to a similar Russian car in Europe. The tests were acceleration, top speed, hill climbing, fuel economy, and (as I recall) handling. The Ford easily won them all. When the results were published in Russia it read: "The Russian car (I don't recall the car's name) finished second, the American Ford finished next to last."

sometime around 1984 or 5,i went to a local flea market and bought a Zenith Transoceanic radio that would pickup shortwave.
I distinctly remember 1 day listening a Russian radio station that was in englsih and a lady said that over 50% of the American people live in cardboard boxes. I was like "UH?" I guess the iron curtain didn't let in much for people to know otherwise.

[Wayne Sheldon]

Susan, I agree with you, mostly, on this. I too, come here mostly to not see what I cannot ignore happening around all of us.
However, I also care very much about our hobby, and the cars it centers around. I care about the history, and the good mostly honest people of the world that may become interested in carrying on keeping and enjoying our beloved model Ts and other antique automobiles into the next century.
The greatest threat to the future of our hobby, and our antique automobiles is not that young people are not interested in them. The greatest threat to the future of our hobby, and our cars is that people conned into believing they should want to live in a state subsidized apartment, living a substandard (by the values of the past century) lifestyle on a minimum wage meaningless job will not have the means to own a home, or have a garage. They will not have tools, nor workspace, to even begin to know the joy of working on something. They will not have mentors beyond videos online to show them the way, because nearly everyone they will personally know will also be living in a state subsidized apartment. Their cars if they have one at all will be leased jellybeans on wheels, with a daily driving range of maybe twenty miles. And they will be taught to be grateful to the state for their riches.
People that do not embrace our history, and do not connect with it in some personal way (like working on or driving a model T) will not really understand that history or even really care about it.
As history gets rewritten, turning everything that made our nation great a half century ago into evil excess, while the real evil excesses and elitists will be said to have saved them, the common people will not even know or understand the truth.

I have over my years to some significant extent restored over ten antique automobiles. I am still working on a few others that I hope to finish in my time left here, That, in spit of the fact I "know" all but maybe two of them in only a few (at most?) decades now will be rotting into the soil, abandoned by people that will not be able to afford to keep them.

This political crap is very much model T related. Like it or not.
I still spend most of my time on this and a couple other antique automobile forums trying to enjoy the cars and the history that I love. And I hope to continue to do so.

[RVA23T]

[Wayne Sheldon]

When I was in high school, more than fifty years ago, I watched several election year "presidential debates. Even for a few years after, such debates meant something. In the past thirty plus years, I have seen nothing in the debates that actually meant anything. Everything, the questions, the responses, the camera shots, were all choreographed to make the entire exercise meaningless.

Now I will step on a few toes.
While decades ago, certain things may have mattered or made a difference? Today? Not so much. It is not about "right" or "left". Certainly "Republican" or "Democrat" makes little or no difference. Nearly all "conservatives" and "liberals" are in the same boat.
Around thirty years ago, everything political shifted to "elitists" versus the other ninety-nine percent of the people.
The cartoon shared by RVA23T is exactly right!

What is the answer? I don't like any of the possible answers. Accept it and go happily down the drain? Many other things cannot be said here.

[perry kete]

[TXGOAT2]

The Oppressor Bird: Mega-government!

[TXGOAT2]

We had an excellent federal constitution, which was carefully designed to LIMIT central government power and reach and empower the citizens.
We do not need any political parties, and we never did need any.
Our constitution has been seriously compromised. (Sixteenth Amendment). What's worse, we do not require that our elected officials respect and abide by what remains of our constitution. We have allowed the federal government to run wild, and we are paying a very steep price for that.
We, The People, still have the power to manage and discipline our national government,and we had better GET TOGETHER and do just that.

[John kuehn]

We need to get together by 2024 for sure. It’s gotten really out of wack in a little over 2 years.
Over 7-8.000.000 illegals have come in over open borders and the majority we don’t know who they are. The federal government has said it’s OK as it is. It’s not OK when laws have become haven’t been enforced. Now we are having wars everywhere and it’s OK? Don’t think so.

[Norman Kling]

I agree with TXGOAT2
I couldn't have said it better. I also believe that we should listen to what the other person is saying, instead of completely cutting them off from our friends list. We can learn a lot by listening, sometimes the other person has a good point. That is also how "debates" should be held. Instead we line the people up and then ask questions. Sometimes the most important points are not even brought up or the person who has the best solution is not asked.
I also like it when the candidate says in a positive way what he/she would do if elected, instead of just negatively condemning what the other is doing. Then let the voter decide which one he agrees with the most and vote accordingly.
Norm

[TRDxB2]

The United States of America's population has & always will have a diverse population composed of citizens of various on races, ethnic backgrounds, religions, genders, financial statuses, generations, sexual preferences, education levels, morals, environmentalism views, socialist vs capitalistic views, suburbanites, city dwellers, physical abilities and automobile preferences. In the past all citizens were part of the silent majority regardless of their point of view. News papers, magazines, radio, television and now "social media" points of view are what influences peoples opinions.
A popular tactic in politics is to use the FUD factor (Fear, Uncertainty & Doubt)against opposing views & candidates. It can be expressed in words (often out of context), sublimely in images or even an outright false hood.

Unfortunately we rely on the media to present an unbiased view of various events & people: but they don't. It is no longer possible to understand the complete story unless one does their own investigation across various media sources, both liberal, conservative & independent. The reality is not many do this and form their opinions on hearsay discussions. In the end we are left with believers & non-believers.

In the Political arena:
Biden's age is challenged rather than his cognitive ability. So why the difference? One is documented & the other is not. Age is not a problem for many (tripping), we don't examples of potential cognitive issues (which way off the stage, not shaking the Brazilian Presidents hand)
Trump's indictments & images. NYC claims Mar-a-Logo & its 17 acres is only worth $18 million (what the county tax assessor's valued it at )

Anyway these are the FUD Factor things that cause peoples' bias & have little to do with how they performed as a President.

[DanTreace]

As a follow along, big government got well underway in the 1920's and has now become a monster.

Had to take this screen shot while watching a 1928 flick, by Howard Hughes, titled The Racket

Very appropriate today. All our representatives and the elected elite, along with the non-elected government are part of the same club.

[tdump]

I must admit, Bush jr was running for his second term when I registered to vote. Every since I have wished for a debate that each person was able to answer a question clearly and as matter of factually. so far,no dice.
I have yearned for the chance to vote for the best man for the job, not just against the worst, But in reality, it takes a person with a warped mind to get involved in politics. No sane man or woman wants their name drug thru the mud because of their position in society. It is easy to turn on the news to see what I am talking about.
Cashless society is another pet peeve. Some places are outlawing cashless business and I am thankful for it.

[BobUkPipedream]

It’s quite easy - to lower your blood pressure, stop watching Fox News. To start feeling happy, stop watching any news channel.
News is designed to draw you in, raise your anger and thus get you engaged. Most of it is exaggerated, half truths.
International news is the most ridiculous - telling me that someone who I never met, from a country I have never been to, has died… what am I supposed to do with that information? Now I feel bad because someone died and they showed their picture, I also feel guilty because half of me is thinking ‘so what?’

Anyway do understand that most news you get told about Europe is rubbish. We actually have everything you have, our tax burden is similar, our politicians are probably a bit better (not much). The one thing of course we do have that you seem to struggle with over there is free healthcare. So when I do something stupid whilst under the Ford, I can just go and get fixed with out having to sell the Ford to pay for it. As for freedom, I get the feeling we have a bit more of it than you simply because we do not need to fear healthcare costs or armies of lawyers. We also don’t have some crazy guy trying to tell us how much our country sucks and how gov is out to destroy you.

Finally do remember what Mark Twain said:
“I've had a lot of worries in my life, most of which never happened.”
Seriously stop watching the news and you will all feel so much better.

[John kuehn]

Dans post it very timely and now days it’s called the SWAMP as the guy that wasn’t a professional politician was and is telling people what Washington has become. For further reading if you want to read all about it check out Glen Becks book “the Great Reset.”
The Reset is planned and beginning to happen. And the neutral folks don’t want to hear about it or take it for granted. And on we go.
If you watch the feel good networks such as CNN, MSNBC and most of the other networks go right ahead and feel as good as you want. When you ignore what’s happening you’ll eventually have a big surprise. Have fun and smile.

[Duey_C]

Hey Sue, at some point we are about to burst. Do not leave here due to my typing else you fall into the trap you lay.
You have much model T things to say. Here's my take from the peanut gallery. We all just bowed. OK, just me.
I saw a post here from a dear friend of this site that was VERY political. Was it a kidding remark? Unknown. Likely not.
Yet it fit the agenda so no question raised. Except for the opposing postings and then we were in big trouble.
Please be careful. I agree completely, except from the right.

[TXGOAT2]

There is no free health care anywhere.
Government is a marginally useful servant for a VERY limited range of purposes, when properly managed by the governed.
Government, including British government, past and present, is VERY cruel and demanding master.
(Which is why the USA exists)
We Americans are allowing our government to decay into a corrupt tyranny.

[tdump]

We hear little sayings and parables when we are growing up,like don't kill the goose that lays the golden egg for example.
But the 1 that applies to America right now is the frog in a pot of water,he feels good,relaxes and enjoys the warm bath,and then by the time he realizes what's going on,he's dinner

[John kuehn]

You’re right about that tdump.
Most news channels ignore what’s going on and very few report the illegal migration crisis, the mobs robbing stores, and most of the news that really impacts people.

Those that don’t take the time to check the real news channels and watch the happy news channels will have a sad awakening when the negative things they ignore comes to their door
Whether they like it or not. The days of being neutral are going away pretty fast.

[TXGOAT2]

Government ALWAYS inclines toward tyranny. Government requires supervision and discipline from the governed, and it must be held to defined limits. Hiding from the news of the day, or excluding all but one source of news and information, is very poor citizenship.

[TXGOAT2]

News is important, and that includes local, regional, national, and international news.

[BobUkPipedream]

Well our healthcare does cost in form of tax, however it is free at point of use to any UK citizen or resident. No rubbish about pre-existing conditions. Our tax burden is high at the moment, but at least we get something for it. The US tax burden seems to be a form of upside down socialism where it supports your richest and forgets your poorest. I love NASA but really the whole Artemis programme and Shuttle programme before it were essentially ways to support industry and shareholders first and space travel second.

I sometimes watch US news as it is interesting and I have to say that Fox is just rubbish, I mean you may as well watch Russian news. Fox is designed to make people mad and it seems so bizarre that Fox News under the direction of its owner Rupert Murdoch (Australian) is destroying US happiness. I also note that if I watch even one bit of Fox, my whole recommended list on YouTube immediately turns into extreme right wing News as in MTG, Jewish space lasers, flat Earth, Mike Lindell etc. Social media is creating a self fulfilling prophecy for anyone who thinks the world is in decline.

The world may be in a bit of a mess now, but it is partly thanks to Putin and Russian bots invading social media and some billionaire who will not stop talking about a certain trip to a hotel in Russia with ladies of the night. Essentially the US and the West in general is under attack, not by their own politicians (no matter how bad they may seem), but by Russia, North Korea, Iran and anyone else we have annoyed in the last few decades. We win this war by recognising that they are trying to make us divided and full of hatred to our fellow countrymen.

Politicians treating their own people bad is nothing new, just look up USS Liberty… However burning the house down because you are fed up with the rats in your basement whilst someone wants to takeover your land just leaves you homeless. So stand for the flag, support your veterans (and don’t call them suckers), don’t be useful idiots for Putin when you vote and eventually everything will come good again.

[TXGOAT2]

Just dreadful. Where does one obtain a Jewish Space Laser? Are they expensive?

[TXGOAT2]

About half the population of the USA pays no net federal income tax, except perhaps for "Social Security", which is a stiff income tax on anyone who is employed in the (shrinking) "private sector".

Businesses and "The Wealthy" pay enormous taxes, as do "Middle Class" Americans.

[Mark Nunn]

I hate being the bearer of bad news or making doom-and-gloom predictions. But, it’s best to face the awfulness of reality than to talk yourself into believing a lie. Those who have chosen to take the blue pill and sink into the ether, content that everything is going to be just fine, might think they’re wise. Instead, what they’re trading is the semblance of contentment now and the very real specter of tyrannical oppression at a later date.

[RVA23T]

The one thing of course we do have that you seem to struggle with over there is free healthcare. So when I do something stupid whilst under the Ford, I can just go and get fixed with out having to sell the Ford to pay for it. As for freedom, I get the feeling we have a bit more of it than you simply because we do not need to fear healthcare costs or armies of lawyers. We also don’t have some crazy guy trying to tell us how much our country sucks and how gov is out to

This is a really rich statement about such a wonderful Healthcare system that just forced a family to lose their infant daughter. Denied them their pariental rights. Would not let them take their baby daughter to another country where they had secured the medical care their baby girl needed with out cost to your so called fearless health care. I can only imagine how many lawyers were involved that denied her parents access to her in hospice. I bet it was so free that your government made them pay for the funeral after you government and Healthcare system too away their parental rights.

There is a reason 1776 we finished the job and decided not be brittish SUBJECTS.

Hello pot, this is kettel.....

[BobUkPipedream]

Jeez Richard, not quite sure where you get your news from. The facts about that story are not quite what you heard… As I said before, much of social media ‘news’ is exaggerated and a lot of it has been placed there to stoke division - you remember what Lincoln said about a house divided against itself?

Anyway 1776 and all that… lot of pent up anger there. Nearly 250 years have passed, don’t you think it is time to let it go? The British are not your enemy and have not been since 1812 (sorry about the White House and all that). The fact is that people like me love America. I have crossed the USA from coast to coast more than once. I have been up in the mountains and down in Death Valley and met all kinds of people and found the American people to be nice, caring and decent. I am not sitting here feeling smug, I am actually deeply worried that a country that I truly love may be sliding into an abyss. I just wished that people would see that it does not need to be this way. Yes we all have immigration issues, yes we all are struggling with change, but the answer is not to start a mini civil war nor to strike out at your allies.

[BobUkPipedream]

Anyway, I am not retired so time is precious and I am not yet a grumpy old dude and quite frankly I find this all stressful. So I will take my leave and bid you all a good day. I hope you can all find some joy and happiness and that things get better. Life is too short for such fear and bitterness, so I hope the colours of the fall and the joy of driving a T through the leaves brings contentment to you all.

Take care,
Bob

[TXGOAT2]

No offense, Bob, but your diagnosis and analysis of America and functional citizens of contemporary America is flawed.
Abraham Lincoln, in a justly famous speech, mentioned a prior generation's creation of a constitution, or set of laws and limits and enumerations and assignments of governing powers "in order to form a more perfect union", and his contemporary generation's striving to preserve and extend the FREEDOM and LIBERTY to do so.
We in America are yet engaged in that same struggle, in a less bloody manner, to preserve and extend freedom, to form a more perfect union, and to preserve and extend the People's liberty to pursue happiness under LIMITED and ACCOUNTABLE government.