Daisy Mae's rear axle

[Daisy Mae]

Continuing on with the restoration of the running gear, up next is the rear axle. Daisy has obviously seen a lot, had travelled across the US in '16, and must have been driven hard, as every time I dig into something she show's me she's hurtin all over.

So, out she came...

She has two different brake rod supports... one maybe from a TT?? Given wider U, which required a wood shim...whatever worked, was good enough!

Some interesting wear pattern on the 4th main...

The axles are gonna be garden stakes, had some serious lateral play going on so diff shim no doubt shot given the drums were eating into the brake shoes, a shattered keyway on one of the axles, roller wear...

[Daisy Mae]

Pulled the driveshaft/torque tube....

The U-jount appears to actually be in pretty good shape, some wear, but no discernable slop, certainly not like what I pulled out of my TT...and no serious wear in the front bushing, at least not enough to reflect any wiggle/play in the driveshaft....

But as good as she looked at that end, the pinion side is a disaster. The spool bearing was so worn it had a good 3/16"+ slop.

The pinion castle nut was pinned with wire bent over each end, but once removed, the nut was finger tight! I spun it right off, and the pinion gear simply slipped off the key/shaft!!!!

I have NO idea why ya'll have such trouble pulling the inner sleeve off the driveshaft... mine simply slipped right off!
Along with showing the first of many discovered cracks...

The spool outer sleeve showing it's wear...

[Daisy Mae]

The spool unfortunately took a beating with all the flopping/banging around inside, as it has multiple cracks...

[Daisy Mae]

Case split, of course the usual 110 yrs worth of sludge...

The babbit thrust bearing was dissolved to sludge... obviously 100 yrs worth of water/acid doing their job... but... also had a big chunk broken and embedded in the sludge....

[Daisy Mae]

The right side thrust bearing is a totally different design, appears to be steel, with a spiral lubrication channel. It too though has stress cracks...

While the pins are intact (but worn), the steel washer locating holes are wallered out, so much so allowing them to drop and eat into the diff carrier....

I have only been able to twist out one outer roller bearing sleeve... the other one I can twist about 1/8" inch, but no joy past that (and yes, the grease cups are removed). The inner sleeves however are being obstinate, and not budging....

[Daisy Mae]

Still in the process of collecting parts... will be a total rebuild, new axle & drive shafts, gears, and all the fixin's...

But LOTS of cleanup to do that will keep me busy for a while....

[Shrshot]

Looks very familiar. The only difference is mine had bronze thrust washers, but everything else was toast too.

[Daisy Mae]

Being an early style diff carrier, the halves were attached via stud/nut, not bolt. While the nuts were cottered (with bent wire), all 3 studs were loose allowing separation of the case. No doubt why Ford redesigned to bolts. I wondered why the nuts weren't wired together in series, but not sure there was clearance to do so.

The spiders, early style with bronze bushings, were badly worn...

The center fiber bushing was literally compressed into 'one wafer thin mint'....

[Daisy Mae]

One axle I know for a fact is original....

The other axle has a stamping that's not quite clear... is it an H/R/B - C/G - S/8...????? Anyone know???

While I still had to press the axle gears off, they did show torsional wear given the keys and axle key slots were badly worn...

Getting back to the driveshaft roller...boy did it endure a lot of torque twist with as much wear clearance existed....
I'm surprised it's still intact...

Needless to say, Daisy has seen a lot of hard miles, and obviously endured a lot of high torque conditions...
I just wish they could talk...but she's definitely telling a story!!!

[Daisy Mae]

Lots of bronze from the spider bushings glistening in the sludge!

The one roller sleeve I pulled was cracked...not sure what would cause a sleeve to crack....excess heat?? Fnding lots of stress cracks in many components though.... I may have the outer shells professionally cleaned & magnafluxed, not that I can see anything...but...

Curious about the stamping on the sleeve.... 340.63
Anyone???

[speedytinc]

I am curious as to the wear on the D.S. roller. It looks quite good, wear wise.
Maybe you could report the dimensions of the rollers.
I see the inner race is really chewed up. Worst I have seen.

[Daisy Mae]

The DS rollers avg 0.553

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

The DS rollers avg 0.553

That ain't good...

[speedytinc]

Thanks.
Lotta wear, as one would expect with a very loose cage & a lotta inner race wear.
But, the rollers sure look nice in your pictures.

[Daisy Mae]

Ya, the rollers looked good, but trash so says the micrometer.
Beyond that, the cage support pins are so wallowed out you can see the twist in the pic, but so ovaled out and thinned pins I'm surprised it was still intact. Looking to be all original never rebuilt, and showing it's age. Well, can't say never rebuilt, I doubt Ford pinned the diff case nuts with bent wire, but not sure what was replaced given all early period parts...
Who knows. One thing for sure Daisy got good use out of what she had!!

[Daisy Mae]

The outer and inner axle rollers are just as worn out unfortunately.
Interesting how much difference between the left & right axle side though...
High & low for each roller
Right outer: .4975 - .4960
Right inner: .4975 - .4965
Left outer: .4960 - 4945
Left inner: .4960 - .4940

[Daisy Mae]

Given all the cracks in the spool I considered it junk, but decided to press out the bearing sleeve anyway just to have a look see internally... yup... Just about another 2 piece of a 2 pc DS!
Cracks were deep, two major ones 60 degrees apart.

[Daisy Mae]

Daisy was a March 14 build... her front spring was stamped 1913... pulled the rear spring, carries a Feb '14 stamp.

There is another stamp, clearly - P 37... but with another leading stamp not fully clear... A? R? Anyone know what that stamp references??

Interesting how the leather pad drew up accordian on one side and not the other...

[Norman Kling]

That's the worst rear end I have ever seen. Were there any parts worth salvaging? It's a wonder it ran long enough that way to get all those cracks and worn parts! Looks like you will need to search swap meets and parts catalogs for new or good used parts to replace the entire assembly. Good luck
Norm

[Daisy Mae]

Ya, I am amazed actually how this thing managed to stay together, but may explain why it was put to rest in 1935. The housings and torque tube/ball, radius rods and U-joint are pretty much all that's salvageable. The brake rods are even wore thru about 60/70% at the supports and the eyelets have very little meat left so ovaled out. Will rebuild welding in some material. What's curious is to see the running gear so well used, while the body itself, as well as the entire chassis
appear relitevely pristine outward appearance.

I've been able to collect good useable serviceable parts for the unobtanium pieces from several members and Chaffin's, everything else will be new.

My TT was actually way worse. The rollers had worn thru the sleeves and deeply into the outer axle halves, the worm rollers were so worn the thrust bearing ate thru worm. I found a good rebuildable axle in Fresno half buried in a pig slop hole.... let me tell you, THAT was sheer desperation to dig that out!!!!!! And back in the 80's very few parts houses carried TT parts. All the bearings I found a guy in Rochester NY making the outer axle & worm rollers/sleeves....he was 90 yrs old at the time!! His bearings are still intact in that TT to this day.

T archeology is an adventure in itself!

[Daisy Mae]

Realized I hadnt posted this other wear point, at the driveshaft thrust bearing from all the flopping around...

[Daisy Mae]

The only parts of the axle that are reusable are the housings, the torque tube, radius rods and U-joint.

[speedytinc]

I have parted quite a few rear ends. Many used as hay trailers, apparently never getting greased after their build.
That is the worst I have ever seen. Amazing you had it in service to this point.
Is it luck or a testament to to the design & quality materials??

[Daisy Mae]

Hey John,
Actually, I just bought her a year ago, and been going thru her one component at a time. The story given was that she was put to bed in 1935 and has never been driven since. Recently got the engine going, where the axle, whether freewheeling under power or by hand made no noise, and regardless of what band under power. Forward motion n her first drive was quiet as well. It was only under reverse on the ground backing into the shop that she protested with a sharp knock when I knew there was trouble. Once around the block was it!
But ya, I seem to have bad luck with axles, as my TT was even worse. My worm gear was equally compromised by bad rollers causing the thrust bearing to groove the shaft.
It's a wonder it didn't just implode. T tough I guess.

[Daisy Mae]

While the internals of the drive train are well worn from some obvious long use, the external components of the car are pristine. I'm used to descaling most every component, frame, springs, axles, etc,and dealing with heavily pockmarked metal. But not Daisy. All her externals, chassis to body are solid.

Here's some pics of the torque tube:

I noticed something interesting on the tube, about mid-length, 4 equally spaced 'U' depressions, obviously some type of 4 point vice/grip. Not sure if these are manufacturing marks, or something else that occurred later. Anyone else ever see these?

[Daisy Mae]

Radius rods were interesting though.
Like components of the front & rear axle, the forged forks are also Dodge.

But stripping the paint I ran thru layers of black, slate blue, green and red. Apparently somebody liked to dress up Daisy periodically. Meanwhile, the torque tube only had black & green, while the axle housings only showed black. The wheel spokes, though currently red, only show black under that, but, appears to be a similar red to the RRods.
Quite a kaleidoscope.