wobbly front wheels

[fireheadman]

Was driving down my neighbors driveway.... which has a couple dips and crowns on the asphault.
Speed was maybe 5-7 mph and all the sudden the front end started to shimmy side to side, like the front wheel were wobbling.

I slowed down and this allowed for the "T" to correct itself.
Since this was my third time driving her... I'm not sure if this is an "expected" thing that can happen in even terrain or if maybe there is something I should look at?

When I repacked the bearings, I sinched up on the bearing nut as there was some slop in it.
It gave me flashbacks of my old jeep wrangler that would sometimes have a "death wobble".


I'm open ears for this one....

[Norman Kling]

Your front wheels are out of alignment. Look up the specs and adjust the caster, camber, and toe in and it should be OK. Also look for loose parts in the steering system.
Norm

[Moxie26]

Wood Wheels?... Tighten the 6 nuts at the wheel hub, check for wear in the complete steering linkage system ... And wheel bearing condition and adjustment.

[Professor Fate]

Just sent a PM. Please be careful.

[Mike Silbert]

It can be caused by many things from loose wheels to loose steering joints to a loose steering box (top and bottom).
Also on the possible list is poor alignment.
And binding front shackles can possibly cause the death wobble due to the front axle / steering design.

So make sure everything that is supposed to move does so smoothly without slop.
And make sure everything that is not supposed to move stays put.
Find someone to help diagnose the issue, I know my arms are not long enough to reach everywhere for a proper test.

Mike

[fireheadman]

thank you everyone for the inputs....

will absolutely take a close look at everything that moves.
if/should there be any slop in some of the joints, like pitman arm or steering arm is there a way to correct those with bronze bushings / inserts?

will also check out the wooden spokes and bolts on them for being loose.


found this in the archive section... this answers my question about the bushings / inserts

[Allan]

What does cinched up the nut mean? There is a proper way to set the front wheel bearings. Get it wrong and there can be trouble, on top of what you are experiencing.

Allan from down under.

[Loftfield]

Not mention so far is checking the wishbone ball joint. Have seen more than one Model T wobble due to loose wishbone attachment at the engine.

[John kuehn]

Jack up the front end off the ground and slowly turn the steering wheel and watch for any movement or slack in the front end parts and the king pins. You’ll be surprised what may be a little loose. That’s the best way to check out the front end parts. Do this first then go from there.

[love2T's]

Was driving down my neighbors driveway.... which has a couple dips and crowns on the asphault.
Speed was maybe 5-7 mph and all the sudden the front end started to shimmy side to side, like the front wheel were wobbling.

I slowed down and this allowed for the "T" to correct itself.
Since this was my third time driving her... I'm not sure if this is an "expected" thing that can happen in even terrain or if maybe there is something I should look at?

When I repacked the bearings, I sinched up on the bearing nut as there was some slop in it.
It gave me flashbacks of my old jeep wrangler that would sometimes have a "death wobble".


I'm open ears for this one....

due to my ADHD and short attention span thereto...this thread is too long already to read the myriad of responses, at least one of which will be this....you have what we call the "death wobble", and 99% of the time it's due to your spindle bushings being shot. Yes, the rest of the steering gear can and will contribute, but start with the bushings, the "black service bible" tells you how to check em but just jack up the wheel and grab it top & bottom and "wiggle it" while observing the spindle bolt bushings. I bet you'll see movement. And it don't take a whole heckuva lot to make it death wobble. Been there!

[TXGOAT2]

One:
It is NOT normal.
Two:
It should be fairly easy to remedy.

[TXGOAT2]

When the vehicle is parked with the front wheels pointing straight ahead, there should be very little or no slack at the steering wheel. In other words, if you reach in and move the steering wheel back a forth a couple of inches, it should cause the front wheels to move. If it doesn't, find out exactly why it doesn't. The vehicle should not shake, shimmy, wobble, or wander when moving down the road. It should be easy to control on any reasonable excuse for a road, under all normal driving conditions.

[John.Zibell]

I had that happen once. Snugged up the spindle bolts and it hasn't happened since.

[love2T's]

I had that happen once. Snugged up the spindle bolts and it hasn't happened since.

Keep a close eye on it...that's often a sign of failing threads on the yoke and in need of what I call the "Steven's Fix".

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

I had that happen once. Snugged up the spindle bolts and it hasn't happened since.

That's often a temporary fix and can mask the real cause. Just something to keep in mind if the trouble returns.

[Steve Jelf]

Causes of wobbly front wheels:

1 A combination of worn and maladjusted parts adds up to "slop";
2 Poor alignment/adjustment;
3 100-year-old wheels worn out or nearly so.

Fixes:

1 Inspect/fix/replace worn parts;
2 Check & adjust alignment;
3 New wheels.

A century of experience is well documented and available. Read. The more you know, the less money you're likely to throw into the bottomless pit.

[John.Zibell]

I had that happen once. Snugged up the spindle bolts and it hasn't happened since.

That's often a temporary fix and can mask the real cause. Just something to keep in mind if the trouble returns.

Trouble never returned. Everything else was tight.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

I had that happen once. Snugged up the spindle bolts and it hasn't happened since.

That's often a temporary fix and can mask the real cause. Just something to keep in mind if the trouble returns.

Trouble never returned. Everything else was tight.

Awesome! Happy touring

[fireheadman]

wow this thread grew a lot over the weekend...
many many thanks to all that have commented.

I have some homework to do now.
I do know my steering column has some slop in it, so will pop that open to inspect the gears inside it.

Guess I will be going through each component/piece and note what is good and bad in terms of being worn out and replacing parts as I go along.

[TXGOAT2]

The Model T steering system is as simple as it could be made, but every part must be in good condition for it to perform as it should. The 3 alignment settings need to all be correct. Both the front and rear springs and shackles need to be in good condition and the engine mounts need to be in good shape, since the engine pan and mounts serve to locate both the front and rear axle. A T chassis that is in good condition will stay that way for many, many miles of service if it is oiled and greased regularly, which is about every 200 road miles, or after any extended period of storage.

[ewdysar]

Hi Ben,

It has been my experience that the Model T "death wobble" (probably a misnomer, due to the slow speeds when it happens, and I haven't heard of any fatalities that started with this) is fairly normal for a worn T. It usually starts with a bump or dip in the road and is a frequency thing and therefore, related to a specific speed. Slowing down or speeding up will usually make it stop for now.

While common, it does need to be addressed. It typically comes from the accumulated slop in all of the components between the steering wheel and the wheel. You may not see significant wear in any one place, but everything adds up. Luckily, most of the wear spots are bushed and the replacement bushings and bolts are readily available.

Keep crankin',
Eric

[TXGOAT2]

Wheels/tires that are way out of true or way out of balance can cause it.

[dinosbunny]

1. check your kingpin
2. check your bearings
3. check your wishbone a oil pan
4. LOTS OF PEOPLE DO NOT CHECK THIS, where the front springs clamps to the front end under your radiator. If the car is older, there use to be a piece of material in between the spring and frame, lots of time it worn out, falls out and it leaves slop from your spring to frame and cause the front (end to move side to side, (death wobble).
all are easy and affordable fixes. You should be able to find the fix on u tube or here on the forum

[fireheadman]

Have slight movement in the kingpin bushings, so planning on replacing those.
bearings appear to be good, but will also degrease those and inspect for odd shape balls/pins (unsure which will be in there)

This weekend I will get to the wishbone along with the steering column.
I am aware of lots of slop in the steering wheel, so the gears are probably long gone

And the space between the frame and spring.. I will look at and take plenty of pictures to spice up this thread with what I find
Once everything is back together, Ron (Club President for Pedal Pushers) has the alignment tools to help get everything back in specs.