Improving Speed on an Improved Car (26,27)

[Model T Ron]

So I am considering a 26,27 Two Door as my second Model T but was wondering what can be done to improve speed on this heaver model T without doing a engine build. Is the aftermarket support for the 26 and 27 as good as what it is for the older cars?

Can an improved car be made to drive a constant 40 mph or is this something that would take major changes?

[Burger in Spokane]

Only drive downhill.

So, why is building the engine off the table ? Magic can be worked
with these T's, if you know the right people and can follow some tips.
I run with the same guys that race the Montana 500, so a number of
their ideas have found their way onto my TT, making a 15mph truck
into a 50mph truck, that can cruise all day at 40. All it takes is doing it.

[Distagon2]

Well one thing is to install a Ruxtell rear axle which is something they did back when the car was new.

[Norman Kling]

On level ground it should be able to go 40, however on hills it will slow down. A Ruckstell will give you a gear between high and low and improve uphill performance, and if on mostly level ground you can install higher gears in ring and pinion gear, but will need to use Ruckstell more often on hills.
Norm

[Model T Ron]

Only drive downhill.

So, why is building the engine off the table ? Magic can be worked
with these T's, if you know the right people and can follow some tips.
I run with the same guys that race the Montana 500, so a number of
their ideas have found their way onto my TT, making a 15mph truck
into a 50mph truck, that can cruise all day at 40. All it takes is doing it.

I know magic comes at a price tag when your not an engine builder lol. Someone who had my 1915 did some amazing work on the engine and added a WarFord into the mix. Long story short I had her up to 58 once and she was still pulling hard when my fear of death kicked in lol. I do not know the HP but my 15 is faster than my Model A with a high compression head.

She may be able to go faster but it seems that 40mph or less is my comfort zone in a Model T.

[Humblej]

The 26-27 T will do 40 mph, but the steering, suspension, and brakes, are not adequate to drive at 40 mph or above. 40 mph is not a comfortable speed for me. I drive top speed of 38 on paved road, 25 on dirt road.

[Model T Ron]

The 26-27 T will do 40 mph, but the steering, suspension, and brakes, are not adequate to drive at 40 mph or above. 40 mph is not a comfortable speed for me. I drive top speed of 38 on paved road, 25 on dirt road.

When I say I can do 40 that's with rear disk brakes. I know its not period correct but I would not have a T without them.

[Craig Leach]

Hi Ron,
IMHO the four most important performance items on a Model T are Lubrication, Ignition, Carburation & Exhaust. If you make it run better
you need to make it oil better. Ignition will open a can of worms so for damage control lets stick to the ford coils. If you don't already have
a copy of the fast Ford handbook find someone that does. Pages 180-183 have the best explanation of making the Ford coils work to their
best performance I know of. Keeping in mind all parts have to be in peek shape. Increasing the size of the exhaust & incoming air fuel
mixture does wonderous things to a model T engine. Model A intake, exhaust & Carb. Work great as do the after market Items sold by the
great venders. This has to be on a strong foundation or you will soon be in the major Changes department anyway.
Craig.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

Well one thing is to install a Ruxtell rear axle which is something they did back when the car was new.

A Ruxtell will make it go slower. Did you mean a Warford transmission, with overdrive?

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

So I am considering a 26,27 Two Door as my second Model T but was wondering what can be done to improve speed on this heaver model T without doing a engine build. Is the aftermarket support for the 26 and 27 as good as what it is for the older cars?

Can an improved car be made to drive a constant 40 mph or is this something that would take major changes?

If your engine is such that it needs a rebuild, it may not go 40 no matter what you do. A good engine in a stock Tudor should get you to 40. Having a Z head and a nice cam will get you there faster.

[TXGOAT2]

There are several sources of tables showing the weight of the various body types and years, both with starter and without. I'm pretty sure the late wire wheels weigh less than the demountable wooden wheels. Lighter wheels/tires will help accelleration and improve ride.

Weight will hurt you on hills and when stopping. Wind drag will limit your speed. There's not much you can do about wind drag with a closed car. Keeping the windows rolled up would probably help. As for weight, don't add any unecessary weight.

I'd suggest wire wheels, 4 ply tires, an Optima-type battery, and a high compression head.

If you don't mind spending ca$h, there are many options for building a fast T.

Take a look at the results from the last several Montana 500 races to get an idea of what a near-stock Model T can do. (Competitors are most all open cars).

I believe you can get a late tudor sedan to average 40 + MPH under most conditions on decent rural 2 lane roads without extensive modification. Headwinds challenge all near-stock Ts, but especially closed cars at road speeds over 30-35 MPH.

[Russ T Fender]

My '27 touring will easily do 40 without any non stock components but I only did it once and, as others have said, I was not comfortable at that speed. If I want to go fast I go modern. I enjoy my T best loping along at 30 or even slower if there's no traffic. For me the plus of an auxiliary transmission is having an intermediate gear for hills. That said, I'd love to be able to afford a New Warford!

[TXGOAT2]

I just finished a 62 mile run at an average speed of 40 MPH. (Garmin) The trip covered about 7 miles of rough gravel, with the rest being rural 2 lane pavement, with about 22 miles on a rural section of historic US 180. Very little traffic.

[Allan]

A Ruxtell is not going to make a car go faster. It may reduce travel time in hilly country if you can use the Ruxtell to climb hills rather than Ford low gear. With a change in final drive ratios in the differential, you may be able to drive at 40 mph. Personally, that is too fast in a model T. Have you considered an A model?

Allan from down under.

[Rich P. Bingham]

T owners who like retro-fitting non-era accessories and other components in search of "speed" might consider the installation of a JATO bottle.

[Model T Ron]

A Ruxtell is not going to make a car go faster. It may reduce travel time in hilly country if you can use the Ruxtell to climb hills rather than Ford low gear. With a change in final drive ratios in the differential, you may be able to drive at 40 mph. Personally, that is too fast in a model T. Have you considered an A model?

Allan from down under.

I have several Model A's and I do not see myself driving any T over 40. If the Improved cars will do that stock then its all I will be needing. Many have said the 26/27's are slower and from what I am hearing it's just getting to speed slower and not holding 40 if needed.

[TXGOAT2]

As you get above 30 to 35 MPH on level ground, aerodynamic drag has more effect on speed capability than weight. A 17 tudor may not have a whole lot more drag, if any more, than a 27 touring with the top up or down. A 27 touring car with 4 adults aboard will likely out-weigh a 27 tudor with a driver only.

[Hap_Tucker]

Ron,

Your profile shows you are living in North Carolina if I read it correctly. If you are planning to drive in any hills or mountains you need to consider that also.

For an excellent data supported article on Model T's and speed on the flat, speed on hill climbing and maximum grade you can climb, please see the Tulsa Chapter's website on Power and Torque at: http://mtfctulsa.com/Tech/power_and_torque.htm

Their test car was a 1926 Tudor -- details at: http://mtfctulsa.com/Tech/larryslist.htm (what they modified, that the engine had been recently rebuilt, running stock coils, all but the driver's seat removed and other modifications (head) etc.)

They also have several other articles that could be helpful to you -- see their technical index at: http://mtfctulsa.com/Tech/larryslist.htm especially:

Fred Houston's 12 steps to a good running Model T for touring at: http://mtfctulsa.com/Tech/fredslist.htm

If your engine is in great shape, you can do it. If your engine is tired, about ready for a rebuild and you start driving fast/hopping it up -- it will probably need rebuilding much sooner than if you drive it at 30 mph. And a lighter roadster would not put as much strain on the engine. And of course all the steering and other parts need to be in good shape. T's have a history of steering issues that can cause the T to turn over (install the front spring perches on the wrong side and you can have a very wild ride, or worn parts or loose nuts or studs etc. )

If you are not familiar with the Montana 500 the official website is at: https://antiqueautoranch.com/montana500 ... sults.html and you will see that the winners (usually a roadster) run about 500 miles at an average speed over 50 mph. But they are really well prepared stock Ts that are even running the cast iron pistons. (Note -- it looks like many of the pages are no longer available on that website. The winners and their average speed is there but not what type of car they were driving. Hopefully someone has saved some of the other information (rules, videos, etc.)

I have both a T and an A. I believe a 1928 Model A Tudor -- would be a much safer, more practical, and less expensive car if you want to drive 45 a lot. I think the T can be made to safely do that -- but would require several modifications to safely and reliably do that. And most non-old car people will not know if it is a T or an A.

Ralph Ricks (R.I.P.) had a very fast speedster that he turned into his "old brass pickup." He could keep up with traffic on the Los Angeles freeway. But he had 4 wheel hydraulic brakes (Metropolitan), an overhead valve set up, used a 1928-ish Chevy 4 cylinder crankshaft, accessory wire wheels, and originally used the Ford Model T 5:1 steering set up (standard for a 1926-27) but in 2001 switched to a 37 Ford set up (ref: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/50 ... 1430758986 ).

It is still true - speed costs money .... how fast do you want to go? And in the T -- you also need to upgrade the brakes and steering as you start going faster and faster.

Good luck and let us know what you decide.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off

[TXGOAT2]

See" www.montana500.com for rules, results, pics, video, etc, from 2022 on back.

[Art M]

In my opinion, the most affordable way to more power is a high compression head. This assumes that the valves and rings are in good condition. Hence, the compression should be above 55 psi. A higher flow needle and seat in the carb is also recommended

The next improvement would be a hotter camshaft, which involves more labor and seems to be unavailable at this time from what I hear.

I have ridden in a near stock 26 sedan with 4 adults that got to 49 mph. This is the fastest I have ever been in a t

Art Mirtes.

[Norman Kling]

If you do decide to place the high compression head, be sure to have a new head gasket on hand before you pull the head. They have been scarce, recently.
Norm

[Distagon2]

Yeah, a Warford not a Ruxtell! I was thinking you would need an overdrive and chose the wrong name, just to clarify.

[Model T Ron]

Yeah, a Warford not a Ruxtell! I was thinking you would need an overdrive and chose the wrong name, just to clarify.

I have a Warford in my 15 Touring and I would think its the way to go over a Ruxtell as you get 3 gears, under drive, low, and high. Under drive was very helpful for me when I was learning to drive my T on my property and also when I took the car to the 4th of July parade. Low or standard gearing is good to 35 and overdrive is good from 35 to god knows what. I tryed to max my car out on a flat straight road and I lost my nerve when she hit 58 and was still pulling hard. I think she would have hit 88 and then the flux capacitor would have kicked in and took me back to 1915

For me 30 to 35 have been my driving speeds but with new tires I may just try to bump that up to 40 when needed. In all honesty Henry never intended the T to be driven at the speeds that they can be made to do......just not a safe idea.

[bdtutton]

I have a 1914 Touring and it is very happy at 35 mph and most of the time I feel like I have control of the car. One day I had the top down, was on a slight downhill and had a little wind at my back and decided to open it up. It did not take long to get over 50mph and the road started getting bumpy and I no longer felt in control....in fact I was scared.
I have a 1930 Tudor with modern shocks and those new radial tubed tires that look just like the originals. I drove the Model A down the same road at 50mph the next day and the ride was smoother, quieter and I felt much safer knowing I had seat belts, an all steel body and 4 wheel brakes. I felt more like I was in control.
.
I love my Model T and wouldn't trade it for anything, but it is not a safe car to go fast in.

[Alan Long]

My 26 RPU is stock standard and lacks the “get up and go lively performance” as I believe most do. I tried the original electronic ignition coils, (Truefire) Z Cylinder Head and no change. The change to a Holley Straight Thru made the world of difference. I can now drive up my “Test Hill” in high gear and accelerating where as before I was back in low. It still has the original inlet manifold and Camshaft. I suspect changing these to a higher flow /Lift would increase output further but I’m happy the way it is at the speeds I travel. I have also swapped the standard NH Holley on a 27 Tourer with the same results. Increasing the fuel line to 5/16” made no difference as fuel starvation (in the flattest state in Australia) isn’t common. Vapourisation can be.
Alan in West Australia

[ModelTWoods]

This is my 26 Fordor sedan, the heaviest Model T body style made. The engine is .040 oversize. Stipe .280 cam , Z head , high volume intake with Stromberg OF carb , Ruxtell rear with 3.63 gears, and Disc Brakes. Will do 50 on level road. maintain 40 on moderate hills. Anything real steep requires Ruxtell Low which slows thing down.

[JohnH]

With my stock standard and worn engine in my 26 I could get up to 75km/h (47mph) on a level road with the wind in the right direction, etc. Best compression was about 35psi in one cylinder; the rest were around 20-25. And that was with coils running on the 6V battery- something many claim is not possible. But, I did rebuild the coils, and made sure they were 100%. And rebuilt the carburettor also - turned down the needle and put in a new jet. Since a rebore, a replacement crankshaft, aluminium pistons, removing the magnets, and installing an E-Timer, I've had it up to 82km/h (51mph). But, on the freeway I keep it below 75km/h just to minimise breaking something.

[TRDxB2]

It has always been true that the first simple changes to improve engine performance is to make it breath better - intake & exhaust modifications. This of course assumes that the ignition system is at its best. Properly tuned coils or even an electronic timer or distributor will make a difference.
Upgrading accessories: carburetor (as Alan noted) is a simple bolt one modification, same for some noted intake manifolds. There isn't an exhaust accessory so such modifications needs to be fabricated. The next step would involve valves & heads but then that's rebuilding the engine.
A Model T's top speed, stock engine is constrained by its maximum RPM hence that's why changes to differential gear rations, Rucktell axles, transmission (Warford etc), or even tire diameter are used.

Take a look at this link and you'll get some ideas about what engine improvements can be made. https://mtfctulsa.com/Tech/fredslist.htm
Also got to the HOME page and check the TECHNICAL section

[TXGOAT2]

A Model T with stock wheels and gearing will go about 50 MPH at 2,000 engine RPM.
Most Ts would do well to go that fast on level ground with no wind.
Aluminum pistons, a balanced engine/transmission, and modern lubricants will allow about 10% more speed.
To go faster than that under the same conditions, you need more power.

On level ground with no wind, horsepower demand goes up dramatically as speed increases. Wind drag is the primary cause of this. Anyone can demonstrate this by driving a T into a headwind, then turning around and driving in the other direction.

Adding an overdrive gear solves the RPM problem, but does not solve the wind drag/power problem.

Adding horsepower and RPM capability can lead to structural problems with the engine.

[Hap_Tucker]

Pat,

Thank you for posting the top link www.montana500.com for the Montana 500 site. All the information is available from there.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off

[Model T Ron]

P1010479.JPG
This is my 26 Fordor sedan, the heaviest Model T body style made. The engine is .040 oversize. Stipe .280 cam , Z head , high volume intake with Stromberg OF carb , Ruxtell rear with 3.63 gears, and Disc Brakes. Will do 50 on level road. maintain 40 on moderate hills. Anything real steep requires Ruxtell Low which slows thing down.

Never considered a 4 door before but that is one nice looking sedan

[NoelChico]

Several years ago, I had my 23 touring at 58mph while passing an Amtrac train on my way back from East Glacier Park to the tour headquarters in Whitefish, Mt. I have a Z head, .280 cam, high volume intake, Chaffins dual exhaust manifold, and Stromberg OF carb. Also, Rocky Mountain brakes. I'd replaced the axles on a Ruckstell rebuild 10 years earlier. Last year, pulling from a stop sign on the Ohio national tour, same car, my right axle broke. I shudder to think if that had happened in Montana on that road!

[TXGOAT2]

Were you able to determine what caused the axle to break? I don't think speed alone would do it.

[Been Here Before]

If you want a coupe/sedan to go faster redesign the body to eliminate the drag. Reduce the frontal area.

Found this on line:

https://www.academia.edu/6471009/CFD_An ... rd_Model_T

https://www.academia.edu/17643611/The_T ... rodynamics

[TXGOAT2]

To get a good idea of what can be done to a T to reduce aero drag and weight on a road-legal T, look at speedsters.

The ultimate low drag T would probably be a drop tank bodied speedster.

About all you can do with a stock bodied T is to avoid adding any unneccesary weight or any exterior mounted accessories that would likley add aero drag, such as dual mirrors, bumpers, outside mounted spare on a coupe, spot lights, flags, raccoon tails, running board boxes, etc.

A T sedan's aero drag may not be as much as that of a coupe or touring car, especially an early touring.

The sedans carry a 250 to 300 lb weight penalty over the open cars, which would have little effect on level road speed. In most hilly country, you go down as many hills as you go up, so weight would have little effect on average speeds, traffic permitting, assuming no long climbs.

A Model A will maintain 45 MPH or better under most open road conditions. Compare specs and comformation of a Stock Model A sedan with a stock Model T sedan.

The Model A has at least twice the power and a higher RPM limit, along with a somewhat smoother profile. The Model A is about 30% heavier.