Hogshead removal

[Flyingpiper59]

Good evening Forum Chums

Going to be doing a removal and reinstall of my hogshead to install new bands….any tips on hogshead removal and reinstall would be greatly appreciated….thanks in advance!
Cheers!
Ed

[jiminbartow]

I see you have a ‘27 Tudor which means you have bands with removable lugs that can be removed and installed through the access door. That is what I recommend due to the fact that, while it is possible to remove the hogshead with the engine in, with everything that is involved with the multiple gaskets and heavy, unwieldy weight of the hogshead, it is virtually impossible to properly re-install the hogshead in an improved T while the engine is in the car. The engine should be removed which is probably easier than trying to install the hogshead from inside the cab. Jim Patrick

PS. Be sure to pack rags all around the interior spaces on each side of the bands to prevent accidentally dropping washers, springs or nuts down into the oil pan.

[Allan]

One good hing with a Tudor is the fact you can remove the seats with relative ease, to greatly improve access.

Allan from down under.

[jsaylor]

I agree with Allen. The seats in a Tudor come out with little effort. Much easier to change bands in my 27 Tudor than in my 21 Touring.

[Tadpole]

I rarely hear it mentioned, and I don't want to overcomplicate things for you, but I have always removed the exhaust manifold when pulling the hogshead. That way I can lift straight up then back.

[Steve Jelf]

Presumably your improved car has the new style bands. The service manual tells you how to change them without removing the hogshead. See pages 136-138.

[speedytinc]

Presumably your improved car has the new style bands. The service manual tells you how to change them without removing the hogshead. See pages 136-138.

True, but, we dont know what type of band material is being re-installed.
Kevlar or wood cant/shouldnt be installed thru the inspection cover.

[Humblej]

Don't remove the hogs head, find some other way of doing it.

[Rich Eagle]

That job is easier if you take the body off first.

[speedytinc]

Or pull the motor.

[TWrenn]

Presumably your improved car has the new style bands. The service manual tells you how to change them without removing the hogshead. See pages 136-138.

True, but, we dont know what type of band material is being re-installed.
Kevlar or wood cant/shouldnt be installed thru the inspection cover.

In a different thread he did say Kevlar. I've heard that often the removable ear bands ain't what they're cracked up to be, plus he said he needs to remove a plugged inside oil line anyway. I doubt that can be done without removing the hogshead, am I correct?

[speedytinc]

You do need to pull the HH to get access to the oil line funnel.
Clear the trash from the funnel & run a slightly frayed speedo cable as a roto-rooter to clear any clogs in the tube. If the tube has any holes, creases or flattened areas, its more prone to plugging up.

HH removal.
Remove the manifolds & exhaust pipe.
Remove the bendix cover, bendix then the starter.(do not remove the starter with the bendix attached.)
Remove the band nuts, washers & springs.(do not drop anything down in.)
Remove the brake & reverse pedals.
Remove the HH & 4th main mounting bolts.
Lift out the HH from front to back.

Reassembly.
Set in your bands. contain them together with the horseshoe tool, bailing wire or plastic wire ties. Kevlar bands must be perfectly shaped round with no bumps, lumps, hi spots or folds.

You can leave the 2 lower 4th main bolts. Cut the 4th main gasket @ pan level. Clean/clear gasket surfaces. Cut a 1/2 section of 4th main gasket for a patch in.
OR remove all 4 4th main bolts & pull the rear axle back 1/2"-3/4" A ratchet strap will work. Pull back the 4th main & remove the gasket. Prep a new gasket. Make a 45 degree diagonal cut @ the top of the gasket to slip in place around the 4th main flange.

Permatex hi tack the gaskets in place. For the front motor seal, I cut a 1/2" wide .062 thick rubber impregnated cork piece of gasket material.
The key here is that the gaskets are GLUED down & wont move during the HH reset. Spread ultra black silicone on top the glued down gaskets with an 1/8" high bead atop the front cork gasket. Squirt a healthy bead in the 4 corner gasket joints.

If you plan on removing the HH easily in the future, wipe a light layer of motor oil or grease on the mating gasket surfaces on the HH.

Lay the HH in place, connecting the throw-out fork, Back to front. Check that the gaskets are still in place. Drop in a few bolts from the top in the mounting holes. Before final bolt down, get the band ears in position & remove the horseshoe, bailing wire or wire ties.

Put in the pan mounting bolts. Work middle back to front. DO NOT pull the HH down by the 2 front corner bolts. Thats how they get broken.

Install the pedals & band hdw & adjust the bands roughly, but loose. Pour a quart of freash oil on the bands a bit @ a time over a 2-3 hour period to insure a full soaking. (I put my bands in dry) Let the silicone dry & the bands to suck up oil overnight before running.

Adjust the rev & brake bands to just function. Low pedal is adjusted with the engine running.
(Tighten low until you can hear the triple gears start to change tone. Back off 1/2 turn.)

The bands will need readjusting 3-4 times minimum. Do not over adjust Kevlar bands. They are very unforgiving! They can feel soft & mushy, like soft cotton. Thats OK as long as you are getting a full lock up. Dont be fooled into over adjusting.

These are the "tricks" I use for a leak free job.

[Allan]

On our RHD cars it is not necessary to remove adjusting nuts and washers or any of the pedals when removing the hogshead, so there is nothing to drop in the innards. Once all the ancilliaries are out of the way, I just haul on the pedals and the cover and pedals come off as a unit.

The same goes when re-fitting. Fit the washers and the put the nuts on a couple of turns on the pedal shafts, and refit as a unit. Again, nothing to fall into the abyss.

I do remove the exhaust pipe, and use a come-along-strap to pull the rear axle assembly back a bit to open up the gap at the fourth main. Occasionally, the exhaust manifold comes off too, but I try not to disturb it if at all possible.

I while back I posted photos of a jig I use to support the weight of the hogshead during installation. It does make the job far less stressful, As does a second pair of hands during the installation.

Allan from down under.

[Steve Jelf]

Kevlar or wood cant/shouldnt be installed thru the inspection cover.

Uh-oh. I did it with Kevlar. Why should I have not?

[DHort]

Install the long felt piece between the HH and the rear of the motor. Let it set overnite. Now it will not move around as you try to place the HH.

[Allan]

Steve, it is difficult not to put some kind of kink in the metal band when fitting them through the hole and down around the drums.. There are those of the opinion that any such out-of-round may lead to high spots on the bands and resultant wear/heat problems. These concerns may or may not be well founded. Your results may or may not back up these concerns.

Allan from down under.

[speedytinc]

Install the long felt piece between the HH and the rear of the motor. Let it set overnite. Now it will not move around as you try to place the HH.

Unless you completely soak/cover the felt with shellac or work in rtv it will weep & look wet.
There is also the issue of different thickness requirements due to the varying width Ford put in the mating edge of the HH. This is primarily an issue with the aluminum units, leading to a greater chance of breaking the front mounting ears. Original Smith pointed this out in a previous post.

[SurfCityGene]

Speedy, Darn good write up and advice on pulling the HH. I also don't ever use a felt because they always leak.. Ultra Black fills the gap perfectly and no leaking!

[Allan]

A felt seal into which ultra black is worked will stay in place during fitting and provide an oil proof seal with no risk of globs of sealant being liberated.

Allan from down under.