Centerdoor running board shields (aprons)

[Will_Vanderburg]

I know it’s been discussed at great length, and I’ve been in the discussion. But I want to pinpoint as close to an accurate answer I can.

Were splash aprons on a Centerdoor the same or different from other model offerings (touring/roadster)? Some people say the same, others say different.

I went over to a friends house who has a Centerdoor. Bearing in mind that I know his has parts that are not correct, I looked and saw that both splash shields were the same as touring/roadster ones. Since the car has one incorrect front fender and the drip rail and windshield header are not accurate, it would safe to assume that other parts of the car are inaccurate.

I suppose I’m asking out of all the Centerdoor owners on here, who has photos of their aprons either during restoration or as they currently sit on your car or pile of parts? I feel that’s the only way to get a definitive answer.

All replies considered.

[Sarikatime]

What year is your centerdoor and what years is your friends? If the car looks good and the splash aprons match your car, paint or patina, don’t worry about it. The whole idea of the hobby is to have fun and not spend sleepless nights trying to find problems. I had an 18 centerdoor that the aprons were the same as all the different models. I loved that car but I thought I wanted a touring, now I want to go back and buy a centerdoor or coupelet.

[Will_Vanderburg]

What year is your centerdoor and what years is your friends? If the car looks good and the splash aprons match your car, paint or patina, don’t worry about it. The whole idea of the hobby is to have fun and not spend sleepless nights trying to find problems. I had an 18 centerdoor that the aprons were the same as all the different models. I loved that car but I thought I wanted a touring, now I want to go back and buy a centerdoor or coupelet.

I’m not trying to lose sleep over it, I’m just wanting to get it as correct as possible. My friends car and mine are the same year, 22-23. (His is early 23, after the low metal firewall change). If the splash aprons are the same, as you suggested they were on your 18, as the rest of the models, then that means the manufacturer is producing incorrect replacement aprons for centerdoors from 17-22.

[Humblej]

The Ford Price List Of Parts dated 1928 has 4 different part numbers for Running Board Shields: 1917-1925, 1922-1924 fordor and tudor; 1924-1925 fordor and tudor; 1926-1927.
The Ford Price List of Body Parts dated 1927 calls the 1915-1923 centerdoor sedans "tudors".
I read this to mean centerdoors from 1917-21 use the same running board shields as the other body styles. Centerdoors 1922-23 have a different running board shield unique to the sedans.

[George Mills]

Hey Will,

I think you have an enigma wrapped in a conundrum going with your question and at the end of the day you flip a coin.

There were apparently 6 generations of the post '15 style splash shields with some of them actually being used concurrently. (keep that in mind)

Using my magic ball, here is my take...

The 4814D and 4815D COULD BE what you are looking for...but no guarantees (due to concurrent assembly?

I have no idea what the drawing shows special for those numbers but I agree with what has been said above. The parts book doesn't lie...it just shows what is backwards compatible for a time frame...same as the 4814C/4815C say good for 1916ish thru 1925.

4814D/4815D did not last long...the gurus who did the original research I think concluded the same thing about the parts books...they marked the 'D' as best guess 1923 one year only and unique to Tudors and Fordor. OOOOOPPS...can you have center door and Tudor/fordor in the same comment as co-exist?

If you don't get a consensus in pictures, or find a 22/23 that made it to final Stynoski as a Centerdoor...Put on your best set of shields...no one can really challenge you. I really can't imagine what changed dramatically enough to warrant a full new drawing level rather than a revision to the old. Unless the punch outs for body bolt passage were different?

[Will_Vanderburg]

I’ve read on the forum in past years where someone needed to raise their Centerdoor body to remove the shields and a forum poster who is a regular stated that the body bolt goes through the shield at the front but doesn’t at the rear, meaning the shield wasn’t attached to the body bolt like a touring/roadster

[Wayne Sheldon]

I know that there was some crossover time between the old style center-door sedans and the new style two-door sedans. I recall reading about a letter the factory sent to all the dealers telling them to push selling out the center-door sedans so that as the new style cars became more available the dealers wouldn't be stuck with the older style center-door.
Style changes were being planned a year in advance. Design refinements and manufacturing equipment altered a month before real production got up and going. Meanwhile orders were still being placed for the older style trying to keep up with demand! Some assembly plants would still be putting out the old style while others may have finished the last of them a few months earlier. I suspect Highland Park was assembling both styles for a few weeks as previous orders for the earlier style bodies were being used up.
I also suspect that both older and newer "tudor" styles during that change-over time could wind up with either the special sedan side aprons or the common any body style side aprons.
A lot of the "sold-as-1923" center-door sedans were actually late production 1922s. Engine serial numbers of course would indicate actual assembly timeframe (so long as the engine hadn't been changed?). I have seen a couple 1923 center-door sedans with steel firewalls. Certainly among the last of the center-door sedans produced.

[Will_Vanderburg]

Wayne,

My friend’s Centerdoor has a metal firewall. His body is exactly the same as mine. However, when my body was given to me, there was no firewall present. Also, no fenders or splash shields

I have a set of splash shields that only mount to the front body bolt and presumably would screw to the bottom of the body. A big hurdle is when you find pictures online of centerdoors for sale, nobody photographs the underside of the car.

[Wayne Sheldon]

Will V, I love it when I see someone taking the remains of a car that really no longer exists, and using bits and pieces of other cars that have been scattered to the winds, raises their car up and makes it whole again! I guess it takes a special kind of crazy to do that. I have done several myself.
I have enjoyed seeing your postings and progress the past couple years on this project! It makes it even better to see efforts to make the car more "right" than actually needs to be done.
The fact is, that it is entirely possible that a very late 1922 or 1923 center-door sedan could have possibly had either style of side aprons/shields. If you choose to use the sedan shields on it? I would never complain about it, or say they were wrong. If it were me? If I had the sedan shields and not a good pair of standard shields? I would likely use them and be quite happy with them. However, I do suspect that the standard shields on center-door sedans would be slightly more correct and more likely to have been what it had originally.

Whichever way you choose to go? Be happy with it and don't let anybody else's opinion spoil it!

[Will_Vanderburg]

Wayne, thanks for the encouragement

For anyone who wants to see my slow progress thus far, check:

army30th.wixsite.com/Centerdoor

[Will_Vanderburg]

OK.......

Here's some information that I think might be useful. I went to my friend's house and looked at and photographed his splash shields. His Centerdoor is a 1923 as it has a low steel firewall. His splash shields look exactly like those for a touring..

I phoned Kathy Tagert in Florida who owns a 1921 Centerdoor. She graciously photographed and videoed the underside of her car. Wanna take a guess??

Her splash shields are exactly like those on a touring.

Now....my car falls in between both of those. Since the other two cars are HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of numbers apart and both have the same type splash shields, what are the odds that ALL Centerdoors from 1917 to 1923 would have shields that match tourings? I would say they do.

So....the possibility exists that the splash shields manufactured by Rootlieb, labeled as 1917-23 SEDAN, are not what they should be. There was only one type of sedan made from 1917 to June of 1923 and that was a Centerdoor.