Rekey Culm Ignition Switch

[ChuckLebeda]

Culm Key Pins

Does anyone have experience rekeying a Culm ignition switch. Previous owner did not have the key to Culm #15; they used a toggle switch to start the 1919 C-door. I bought a Culm key #68 that fits the switch. But have to rekey the 'pins' to fit key #68. There are 10 pins to the switch. They are in the shape of a letter 'H' with 3 different sizes to the pins. There has to be some logic to rekey, but I can't figure it out? See photo of 'pins'.

[Dan Hatch]

Sounds like a job for Ben Martin.

[TRDxB2]

The 'pins" are called 'wafers' The key is cut with high & low spots. So the process is to insert one wafer at a time so that it does not ride above or below the tumbler. Since there are 3 different wafers that gives 6 positions thick end up or down. work from the first wafer from the end away from the front after you do a few you'll catch on what the rest need
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I should have added. that the peaks & valleys of the key determine what wafer needs to be used. you can even determine which to use outside the tumbler based on how the hand. By the way what switch is this for?

[Stu Tomlinson]

This Clum key look more like something for Dodge Brothers. This wafer type key was not used for a model T. I am certain there is someone out there who know something about these keys and ignition switches, but they are not the issued with the Model T.

[jab35]

Chuck: Frank gives good advice. If for some reason you cannot get all tumblers/wafers to 'work' with that key, your switch will still work if you leave several 'blank'--ie, several slots without wafers. Best of luck, jb

[ChuckLebeda]

Frank: Thanks for the info. Attached are photos of the switch, tumbler, and contact points. When I install the tumbler/etc without the wafers in the dash, the key turns 360 degrees. Then I can't tell if the contact points are on battery or mag or somewhere within 360 degrees. I am assuming the wafers prevent the key from turning 360; but maybe not? These ignition switch is a Culm. The recent MTFCA magazine has an article about the different switches that Ford used in its cars. I would like to get this Culm switch back to working as it is an unusual ignition. My dash is covered in leather and other switches wouldn't fit.

Question: Should I start the wafers from the round part of the key or from the pointed part?

I have keyed doors locks with pins, but these wafers are difficult. Also not sure if key #68 is right for the tumbler, but it does fit?\
Thanks, Chuck

[ChuckLebeda]

Frank:
Meant to post that I am not sure what prevents the key from turning 360 degrees? The key should not turn left past the BAT marking or right past the MAG mark. Not sure if the wafers will prevent this?
Chuck

[TRDxB2]

Frank:
Meant to post that I am not sure what prevents the key from turning 360 degrees? The key should not turn left past the BAT marking or right past the MAG mark. Not sure if the wafers will prevent this?
Chuck

I need to see the back of your switch an any other parts that you may have.
The flat at the end of the tumbler is supposed to catch on an internal piece that's part of the switch. Not sure what yours looks like
For example

mag stop.jpg (85.48 KiB) Viewed 2684 times

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The Clum Model T switches have different internal part than the more common rectangular & oval switch plates (most often the common are identified by two horizontal rivets holding the back of the switch to the face plate).
These are two different Clum switch version for Model T

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Some of the parts above look similar to your pictures

[Don Demio]

This is an early Clum key and switch for a Model T Ford. The text and drawing of the key is from the May - June issue of the Model T Times page 23. It is a portion of a 2 page article by Trent Boggess on Model T Ignition Switchkeys: 1913 - 1927. Unfortunately I do not know how to rekey the switch tumbler or how to post the photo of the actual switch with the key. If there is someone out there who can - go for it. I hope this images will validate what you have.

Have a great day,

Don

ClumZig Zag Keys for a T text.JPG (29.35 KiB) Viewed 2620 times

Early Clum Number Round Key with Zig Zag Key Tumbler 2.docx

(70.48 KiB) Downloaded 84 times

[Adam]

Post a couple pictures of the cylinder that are in sharp focus and not all fuzzy. I am suspicious that the cylinder is incorrect or has been modified and/or there are some other parts missing…

[ChuckLebeda]

Okay, am posting some more pictures. These are all the parts that I have. So not sure if I am missing any.
However, it seems to me something should stop the cylinder from turning 360 degrees?

Thanks for everyones help and comments.
Chuck

[ChuckLebeda]

More picts

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376E0F6D-D988-4D0C-B665-63A392DC70DE_4_5005_c.jpeg (15.17 KiB) Viewed 2522 times

[ChuckLebeda]

Inside of switch showing back of tumbler. Is a part missing that would prevent tumbler from turning 360?

[ChuckLebeda]

I did get the wafers working in the tumbler. I caught 9 wafers in and when I put in #10 the key would not turn. So per James recommendation, I left out wafer #10 and it turns. However, the key still does the 360 degree turn. I must be missing a part that prevents the tumbler from turning 360?

Thanks for everyone's help!

Chuck

[TRDxB2]

I did get the wafers working in the tumbler. I caught 9 wafers in and when I put in #10 the key would not turn. So per James recommendation, I left out wafer #10 and it turns. However, the key still does the 360 degree turn. I must be missing a part that prevents the tumbler from turning 360?

Thanks for everyone's help!

Chuck

I remembered another CLUM switch I had & its internals are similar to yours. You need to left off the plate shown to see if the the stops are there

EC789B26-5489-48F0-8E52-620547502F17_4_5005_c.jpeg (78.93 KiB) Viewed 2444 times

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The tumbler should hit the stops to prevent it from turning

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Do you have these springs? The center round piece may noy have a spring like mine but needs something to keep it pressed against the backing plate to make contact (band type spring?). The screws hold the plate to the internal part that is rotated by the handles

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Fitting it together. Springs on the red circled posts . Screws to the arrows

what goes where.png (286.78 KiB) Viewed 2444 times

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My switch

[RajoRacer]

Just a FYI - that Clum switch was for the earliest starter equipped cars - closed for sure - not sure about the open starter cars. It is the only year (1919) that utilized the cast light lever & fancy ammeter. I have that same Bosch panel (switched out the cast lever switch) in my Racer !

[ChuckLebeda]

Frank: Thanks for the pictures. I do have the 3 springs for the outer ring and the single spring for the center. Pict #5845 looks like mine but I don't seem to have any stops to prevent the tumbler from spinning? I have the switch all back together. Will take it apart and look again. Thanks again! Will let you know. Chuck

[MariaDenesik]

Replying for the updates.