engines

[Gen3AntiqueAuto]

As most of you know, I have been building engines "to order" for a number of decades now, with one exception - the "green thunderbolt". I built that on a whim and decided it was one to put in inventory while I waited for a buyer. The buyer never came and a year later I blew up the one that came in my fordor so "in it went". That was in 2007/2008. My reason for posting is to ask a question. If I build a few engines "for inventory" - would they sell fairly quickly in 2024? I've noticed a huge supply chain problem in the hobby, everyone that used to make stuff either died, retired, or has a many month long waiting list. So is there a market for "off the shelf" T power plants? There does not seem to be a market for the individual (used) pieces anymore...

[Charlie B in N.J.]

I’m thinking short blocks. What always bothered me most about the T was my inability to replace crank bearings. Rods aren’t cheap either but they are at least available. If I ever blew a crank bearing I’d basically have A 4 wheel boat anchor as the cost of a rebabbitt would be prohibitive for me on its own but I’d consider the expense of a good/repaired short block. Especially if a discount for an exchange was involved.

[Gen3AntiqueAuto]

This is about what I expected!

[RGould1910]

Just an off the wall observation. Most folks would want the same year engine that came out of their car. Especially true for brass era car owners. Pretty hard to anticipate which engines would be needed.

[signsup]

In the vintage military vehicle hobby, the trend is to pull out a engine in need of rebuilding and swap in a similar engine. The process may take a year or longer and the original block may or may not be rebuildable, so rather than take the vehicle out of circulation for a year or longer, they run another engine and swap back in the rebuilt original or leave the replacement in if the original is not rebuildable.
So, I would think the same would be true in the Model T hobby. Yes, most would want the numbers matching correct year engine, but would also like their vehicle to be running while the process is going on. Something off the shelf that is plug and play would be marketable, I would think.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

Admittedly, I have not watched many of your videos. Do you do your own boring, honing, babbitt, valve seats, etc.?

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

These are my opinions & experiences offered as an engine rebuilder. Do not offer a Short Block!! Most hobbyists in today's world do not have the ability to finish the assembly correctly. Even if they have the talent, they will be too frugal to finish the job properly. Additionally, you likely will spend all of your profits made on that short block answering your customer's questions as they try to finish the build. And generally speaking, when their assembled results are less than stellar, you are the engine Rebuilder that receives their negative feedback to others.

Second, -your answer likely comes from what your goals are. Compare yourself to a Tailor. Do you want to cater to a customer who is satisfied with an off-the-shelf business suit, -or do you want a customer who wants a suit that custom fits to exacting standards? As someone who has been a professional restorer since the late 1990s, it has been my experiences that the ones who wanted the cheapest always complained the most. People who complain are costly to deal with.

And lastly, I made a comment the other day about the least profitable area in my entire shop (-which includes my upholstery shop, machine shop, wood shop, sheetmetal shop, paint & body shop, assembly shop, et/al) is my machine shop. The costs associated with having a quality machine shop far exceeds the ROI for the typical Model-A/T job. Adding to that, the levels of expectation in this day & time have reached a point where older, worn tooling is not profitable when doing the job, simply due to the extra time it takes to complete the job and the level of results those machines produce. A few months ago I had to provide my insurance company with a replacement costs of my machines & tooling, and after updating my list I am approaching $150k for tooling and machines. Sure, you can outsource some tasks but then you are wasting valuable time traveling to/from the subcontractor, plus your reputation is vulnerable to their craftsmanship. In this day & time, good reputations are key to being successful (-i.e.: profitable). Therefore it is almost imperative that the engine Rebuilder has their eyes on every facet of the rebuild process beginning with the disassembly, and then throughout the machining and finally thru the assembly. Think this through for a moment. The reason that most rebuilders do not have rebuilt engines on the shelf ready to exchange is because they have a backlog of customer work that has priority. Any shop that does not have a backlog of customer work in these times is likely a shop that most hobbyists need to avoid anyway. Just some food for thought. Best wishes in whatever you decide to do.

[Craig Leach]

I'm with Brent. No matter how good of a job you do on an engine the guy with a broken crank will not be happy when he puts the short block on
the same twisted pan & brakes the crank in the one you sold him! I have a complete, fresh & test run 23 engine sealed & in storage that can go
in both of my cars if needed. It's put together using all of the useable parts from other projects. It all so takes up less space put together.
If you are going to have on the shelf engines I would think complete test run & broke in engines would be safer on the reputation.
Craig.

[ModelTWoods]

Living in Texas, I have known of at least 5 antique engine rebuilders, who have been in business within the last 30 years. One, I know has retired and is no longer is in business. The status of two others is questionable. I haven't talked to anyone who has been in contact with them in the last 10 years. Two, I know are still very much in business, and I am quite sure their engines are built on a custom order basis. I agree with Brent and Craig, there would be headaches trying to stock and sell rebuilt T shortblocks and warranty them, not being able to control the final assembly of each motor.

[NealW]

These are my opinions & experiences offered as an engine rebuilder. Do not offer a Short Block!! Most hobbyists in today's world do not have the ability to finish the assembly correctly.

I have rebuilt two engines for our Model T's as a hobbyist, and I would tend to agree with not offering a short block unless you know who it's going to and are convinced that they can correctly assemble the rest. If a person doesn't have the aptitude or tools to rebuild a short block, then I'm not sure that they have what it takes to put the rest of it together. Things like not getting the pan straightened, getting the magnets properly charged and the proper gap set to the magneto are very important to having a great running engine. Messing this up could cause problems even if the short block was done correctly. Having a long block assembly available for sale could certainly be desirable if someone needs an engine.

With that said, we certainly could use more places around the country that are set up to do babbitt work and machining work on the blocks. I was very fortunate to be able to have that done for me by those equipped to do so; even getting the pans straightened. The rest of the job, both the short block and the long block, are doable for the hobbyist if you have basic mechanical aptitude, have the correct tools and follow the Ford manual and MTFCA booklets, and watch Mike Bender's videos.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

...we certainly could use more places around the country that are set up to do babbitt work and machining work on the blocks. I was very fortunate to be able to have that done for me by those equipped to do so; even getting the pans straightened. The rest of the job, both the short block and the long block, are doable for the hobbyist if you have basic mechanical aptitude, have the correct tools and follow the Ford manual and MTFCA booklets, and watch Mike Bender's videos.

From my view, there are plenty of machine shops around the country that could/would do bearing casting -IF, the process was more lucrative in doing Model-T and/or Model-A engines. The irony is a 4 cylinder Buick, Maxwell, et/al engines from the same era see rebuild prices about double of what people want to pay for a Model-T engine rebuild. Cleaning, crack checking, boring, honing, decking, etc. have about the same labor time on the other engines as it takes for a Model-T. Casting the bearings and line-boring is about the same or possibly around 25% longer in labor on the non-Fords, ...and crankshaft grinding and straightening a 7 journal crank is generally not much difference in time between the two from my own experiences.

I am a member of a couple of social media machine shop owners groups, and in listening to these shop owners from around the country share what their hourly shop rates are, it appears it is rare to find one under $100 an hour, -and most are in the $125-$150 range doing non-performance automotive and light-diesel work. Sp let's use the middle of the road $125 per hour range for this discussion. For me, I really need to be bustin' it to clean & degrease a crankshaft, wet magnaflux it, media-blast it, straighten it, set-up and grind 7 journals on my Storm 15 grinder, re-straighten it, and then polish it ...all within 3 hours. The typical Model-T hobbyist wants that work to cost in the $200-$250 range. To do a good job on this takes most shops 3 - 4 hours from floor-to-floor. That comes in about $375-$400.

Now figuring the time to cast Babbitt bearing material onto 3 main webs and onto 3 caps, line-bore it, and set the thrusts is generally a 4-5 hour job for the experienced. Then factor in supplying the shims, and materials (Babbitt, Tinning compound, damming compounds, freight, etc.) necessary and you are 'north' of $100 if corners are cut. Many prospective shop owners do not get excited to learn, -or take on this type of work when there are expectations of having all this work done for around $850-$900. Remember, other marques of vehicles find similar engine rebuilding costs generally 2x - 3x more $$. I think eventually it will work itself out where the costs are inline with work being performed on other similar engines. At that time, there will be machinists casting bearings again.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

...we certainly could use more places around the country that are set up to do babbitt work and machining work on the blocks. I was very fortunate to be able to have that done for me by those equipped to do so; even getting the pans straightened. The rest of the job, both the short block and the long block, are doable for the hobbyist if you have basic mechanical aptitude, have the correct tools and follow the Ford manual and MTFCA booklets, and watch Mike Bender's videos.

From my view, there are plenty of machine shops around the country that could/would do bearing casting -IF, the process was more lucrative in doing Model-T and/or Model-A engines. The irony is a 4 cylinder Buick, Maxwell, et/al engines from the same era see rebuild prices about double of what people want to pay for a Model-T engine rebuild....

.... Remember, other marques of vehicles find similar engine rebuilding costs generally 2x - 3x more $$. I think eventually it will work itself out where the costs are inline with work being performed on other similar engines. At that time, there will be machinists casting bearings again.

Brent,

I kind of suspect that the relative values & rarity of other makes may play into what folks deem as "reasonable" to rebuild those engines. Not an apples-to-apples comparison I know, but steam car folks seem to be the most "generous" when it comes to rebuilding their engines... but then their cars are pricing out just near, or over, the $100K mark. Out of curiosity, how do Model A engine rebuilds compare in price to Model T's?

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Brent,

I kind of suspect that the relative values & rarity of other makes may play into what folks deem as "reasonable" to rebuild those engines. Not an apples-to-apples comparison I know, but steam car folks seem to be the most "generous" when it comes to rebuilding their engines... but then their cars are pricing out just near, or over, the $100K mark. Out of curiosity, how do Model A engine rebuilds compare in price to Model T's?

From my vantage point, the Rarity or Values really should not enter in the the pricing as far as the machinist/rebuilder is concerned. If it does, maybe that is someone taking advantage of someone else? For example, if I were to typically charge $350 to bore & hone a 1915-1927 Model-T block, but I charge $500 to similarly bore & hone an 1909-10 open-valve block ...just because of the early block's rarity, then wouldn't you agree that tends to not be that ethical? To me, that IS still apples-to-apples by comparison. When you compare a similar year Maxwell, Chevrolet 490, Overland, or whatever to a Model-T, the resale values comparatively are close. The engine rebuild labor costs from the machine shop's vantage point should be similar too. Unfortunately, many Model-T owners likely do not share the same thoughts.

As far as what does someone deem as reasonable, ...THAT is where the issue has been for this hobby going on years now. For me, I know what my machines cost to own, rebuild, & maintain. When I factor in my overhead and labor costs, I know what the shop as a whole must generate per hour to sustain itself. Not every potential customer deems this cost as a value to them. If enough of these prospects deem my costs are not a value, then I am forced to find alternative revenues for my skills & equipment where I can remain profitable. This is why there are fewer commercial Model-T engine rebuilders now.

Model-A short block rebuilding are very close comparatively between the two. What changes is when the Model-T oil pan straightening, magnet recharging, and coil ring adjusting costs are added.

[George Mills]

Schwalm's in PA use to do a decent rebuild to a T, either short block or long block. Their specialty is A blocks, A power plants and the T's were a bit of fill in. Good work, great work, never heard anyone say anything bad about their work. In the day, Schwalms would take on T-tranny work, T differential work, but slowly it reduced to just power plants.

Their lead time then went out to 2 years plus on T work...dunno if their A work is that long...and today if you look at their web site there is zero mention of T work being possible. Might suggest you make a call and talk to Ora?

They at one time decided to do a full crate Model T power plant for inventory (it may have been a for hire work that went south? I dunno). It was what could be called blueprinted, everything was done to new tolerances, it was a 'crate' complete plug-n-play power plant including the starter and generator rebuilt. There were no questions about it, they willingly shared exactly what they did as a line item, and the asking price was (then) like $8K. That was maybe 10-12 years ago? They sat on it forever and finally lugged it to Hershey on a great wooden engine stand (Amish, ya know?). I am not sure but 'heard' that they eventually bit the bullet and let it go for then $6500 rather than lug it around.

The point? Most T guys will not pay what a real rebuild is worth as in many cases it is actually more than they paid for their T in the first place...and a lesson from Schwalms is in place...they insisted on touching EVERYTHING and making it absolutely right...no questions later, no snarks on social media, no need for a warranty claim. To do so, the $8K was about right at the time (Probably 10-11 today). I wasted near an entire afternoon just standing there staring at it at Hershey that year...the old within an inch of saying 'why not'? But then did pass as I had absolutely no need for it and would have to come back for it as all space was already full.

As to what things are worth, using a Model A close enough analogy...take a look at Schwalms web site, he starts with a general short block decent overhaul at a fixed price...goes to a long block decent overhaul at a fixed price... and then reads like the dealer window sticker on a 64 Chevy! Every possible 'oh boy' is identified with a price to correct or do the needed work.

http://www.schwalms.com/services.htm

[Moxie26]

George... I was blessed by a great service at Schwalm's nearly 25 years ago when they rebuilt the engine in our 26 runabout. It is still running great. Ora and his crew are first class .

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

Brent,

I kind of suspect that the relative values & rarity of other makes may play into what folks deem as "reasonable" to rebuild those engines. Not an apples-to-apples comparison I know, but steam car folks seem to be the most "generous" when it comes to rebuilding their engines... but then their cars are pricing out just near, or over, the $100K mark. Out of curiosity, how do Model A engine rebuilds compare in price to Model T's?

From my vantage point, the Rarity or Values really should not enter in the pricing as far as the machinist/rebuilder is concerned.

Brent,

I agree completely. You miss my point. My point was meant to be from the perspective of the customer, and what they are willing to spend, and not what you might base your prices on.

[greenacres36]

I have been a machinist for a few decades, and I can share some insight on this subject maybe. I am not a professional engine builder, but have worked in industrial repairs my entire career. This may not be a good excuse for charging anymore for an early block, but if I am involved in a project where if I happen to make a mistake or scrap a part, it is much much more difficult to explain that to the boss especially when it’s something that cannot be replaced easily. I suppose if I was doing the machine work and assembly on an open valve engine , I would be much much more paranoid for lack of better words and I probably would go a little slower. I don’t know if that’s a great answer or not but I think that might be the way I would approach it. Not saying that everybody shouldn’t get the same quality of work but I guess it’s just characteristic of me to be much more tedious and go a little slower on something that cannot be easily fixed if I screw up. Good luck trying to find another open valve block to replace a stupid mistake.



Brian

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Brent,

I agree completely. You miss my point. My point was meant to be from the perspective of the customer, and what they are willing to spend, and not what you might base your prices on.

Jerry, I think we do agree. The issue is that the guys that are already in the business are often-times unprofitable because they base their prices on what their competition is charging, -or by what they think the market will bear. Both of these are quick ways to lose money or be unprofitable. Often times a business will look at their competition's prices and think they must be profitable charging that amount. .

I have been a machinist for a few decades, and I can share some insight on this subject maybe. I am not a professional engine builder, but have worked in industrial repairs my entire career. This may not be a good excuse for charging anymore for an early block, but if I am involved in a project where if I happen to make a mistake or scrap a part, it is much much more difficult to explain that to the boss especially when it’s something that cannot be replaced easily. I suppose if I was doing the machine work and assembly on an open valve engine , I would be much much more paranoid for lack of better words and I probably would go a little slower. I don’t know if that’s a great answer or not but I think that might be the way I would approach it. Not saying that everybody shouldn’t get the same quality of work but I guess it’s just characteristic of me to be much more tedious and go a little slower on something that cannot be easily fixed if I screw up. Good luck trying to find another open valve block to replace a stupid mistake.
Brian

Brian, I think what you are suggesting is definitely how many businesses today operate. Just because that is how many businesses operate does not make it proper or ethical, ...at least in my eyes.

Additionally, when profit margins are slim, businesses often look for ways to cut corners on procedures as a way to be a little more profitable. Maybe they skip pressure testing or magnafluxing a parts to save time? Maybe they reuse part of the babbitt scrapings to save money?? Maybe just skip the honing process in an effort to save time. The reality is when we have a project to work on that is profitable, we do tend to go slower and be more tedious with our craftsmanship. Even a regular engine rebuild on a common Model-T engine deserves that level of detail to enhance longevity. Also, this is to my point where shops looking to get into doing Model-A/T engines soon realize that either they must charge more or flat-rate the job based on the allotted funding for the job. Most probably take the attitude it isn't profitable for them and so they choose to skip the frugal customer's jobs and do the profitable work.

[AndyClary]

You might well be better off assembling build kits for yourself. Crank, rods, timing gears, pistons, gasket set, cam and bearings etc. then when you get a job in you have everything, machine the block and build. It would be less money on the shelf and you would have some supply chain protection.

I would consider building transmissions on spec. Mostly labor, not a lot in parts if you have a core supply. Don’t take up much room.


Andy

[Gen3AntiqueAuto]

Admittedly, I have not watched many of your videos. Do you do your own boring, honing, babbitt, valve seats, etc.?

Right now I am more focused on passing on 40 years of Model T restoration information via videos than having a shop with a waiting list. I wish I had filmed my grandfather for all the years I had him with me. My grandson will have access to my knowledge even after I am gone. I do have room here now for two engine rebuilds (no car) or one rebuild/restoration/vehicle but I expect I'll be pulling something off the pile and restoring it for you guys on camera.

I do my own honing. babbit, valve seats, etc. I do outsource the boring and balancing due to lack of space, money (those machines are expensive), and electricity (30 amp service). Been doing this since 2001 in this location. The trade off is wait time and as someone said - the other guy's work is on my rep. Not having half a million dollars for equipment makes outsourcing easier to justify.

When the new building is up I will be investing in more machines and doing more in house, possibly with an apprentice. Just waiting on the youtube money to start rolling in so I can afford it! Best part of my videos for you all is "they are free" and you can watch them over and over and over while you fight with whatever part of the job you're stuck on.

[J and M Machine]

Admittedly, I have not watched many of your videos. Do you do your own boring, honing, babbitt, valve seats, etc.?

No he doesn't:
For a while he was our best source of work as we would do his engines over again after his customers paid him for a complete rebuild.


We're not bashing him I am stating a Fact., see what his customers said.
https://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/1 ... 1318139851
https://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/2 ... 1335212463


You have to remember that this is the internet and anyone can portray himself to be an "Expert". Most often "Armchair experts" are most dangerous.
Making videos doesn't make you an engine rebuilder with; "Decades of experience" I have to laugh at this statement.

We have pictures of his engines in question to back up our words along with the posts from this forum.
What gets typed on the internet stays on the internet.

For any legitimate rebuilder, there are ten of these guys that say they can do it only to ruin a rare engine. Offering low prices and then sending all work out to shops that don't understand what's involved in rebuilding an engine, nevermind being a Model T and it's getting worse.

We charge a fair price for what we do and it is a through job. We do a variety of engines as just doing one particular brand is not cost effective to support over a million dollars in machines.

Furthermore if the old comments from this forum don't resonate ,

These pictures enclosed show his babbitt, engine was loaded with "Time saver"

When I had initially commented back in 2006 in forum everyone was jumping on us that we were attacking him as Foye was the end all to Model T rebuilding.
As then as now I am showing the true light of what it is.
Before someone else falls for it and gets a painful lesson in a pile of engine parts that don't work.

[jab35]

Thank You John G for the photos and for your candid assessment of the situation. You confirmed my suspicions.

I always wondered how an 'established' rebuilder could find the time to make and pitch so many amateurish video snippets seemingly intended for pure entertainment. That U-tube vid of transmission disassembly using a claw hammer and furniture clamps as a puller does not give the same sense of technical competence that the vids by rebuilders like Mike Bender do. Respectfully, jb

[Greg sarky k]

I’m not an expert on engine rebuilds. I only know it would be foolish not to listen to the advice of J and M Machine. They are one of the best engine rebuilders in the country. They have done 5 T engines for me. Here are some shots of them working on one of my 1912 engines

[speedytinc]

Thank You John G for the photos and for your candid assessment of the situation. You confirmed my suspicions.

I always wondered how an 'established' rebuilder could find the time to make and pitch so many amateurish video snippets seemingly intended for pure entertainment. That U-tube vid of transmission disassembly using a claw hammer and furniture clamps as a puller does not give the same sense of technical competence that the vids by rebuilders like Mike Bender do. Respectfully, jb

I have been staring @ that magnet keeper with the grey goo for a good 30 minutes trying to decide on commenting or not.
JB, you put me over the edge.

I watched 3 transmission videos that should have been called how not to.
@ first I thought it funny, then realized this guy was "teaching" folks how to destroy transmissions. Using a crowbar to remove a H/H that still had bolts in, using the wrong tools, etc, etc. The unaware will lap this garbage up. Its unfortunate a hack can make enough off U-tube to build a shop. Like the clown that abuses/destroys model T's for views. I would strongly discourage folks from watching/supporting these videos.
Most glaring from the video, I saw a guy with no mechanical ability.

BUYER BEWARE.

[TWrenn]

I'm thankful as well as lucky we have Joe Bell just 35 miles from most of us. He's gonna be doing an engine for Clara for me this coming winter and I can't wait then for next spring! Yep...wishing my life away! Oh well.

[MKossor]

I watched 3 transmission videos that should have been called how not to.
@ first I thought it funny, then realized this guy was "teaching" folks how to destroy transmissions.

The same can be said for his coil testing and tuning videos. How Not to test and tune coils. Travesty newbies view and believe the knowledge and methods shown are actually how coils should be adjusted.

Even more frustrating was attempts to correct and educate proper methods and techniques were futile and totally wasted effort.... he advised me people like Bruce McCalley have called him for advice.

[RGould1910]

I watched only one video, the one where he was installing a clutch pack. In disassembly, he noted the three thrust washers were scored. On reassembly it looked like things had not been cleaned, but maybe they were while the camera was off.
The parts I questioned were
1. The disc drum slid over the transmission shaft easily but that didnt seem to bother him.
2. He never measured or adjusted the play between the thrust washers and the disc drum. He simply put the set screw in and tightened it down. I figured he'd come back and check the clearance but never did. He buttoned things up and that was that. I thought this strange since he was aware the washers he pulled out were galled.
In fairness perhaps he addressed the fit of the disc drum on the transmission shaft and checked/adjusted the thrust washer clearance off camera, but honestly I doubt it.

[Gen3AntiqueAuto]

You're just itching for a defamation lawsuit arent you. Just because YOU are MY competitor, doesn't give you the right to lie about me on here.

Admittedly, I have not watched many of your videos. Do you do your own boring, honing, babbitt, valve seats, etc.?

No he doesn't:
For a while he was our best source of work as we would do his engines over again after his customers paid him for a complete rebuild.


We're not bashing him I am stating a Fact., see what his customers said.
https://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/1 ... 1318139851
https://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/2 ... 1335212463


You have to remember that this is the internet and anyone can portray himself to be an "Expert". Most often "Armchair experts" are most dangerous.
Making videos doesn't make you an engine rebuilder with; "Decades of experience" I have to laugh at this statement.

We have pictures of his engines in question to back up our words along with the posts from this forum.
What gets typed on the internet stays on the internet.

For any legitimate rebuilder, there are ten of these guys that say they can do it only to ruin a rare engine. Offering low prices and then sending all work out to shops that don't understand what's involved in rebuilding an engine, nevermind being a Model T and it's getting worse.

We charge a fair price for what we do and it is a through job. We do a variety of engines as just doing one particular brand is not cost effective to support over a million dollars in machines.

Furthermore if the old comments from this forum don't resonate ,

These pictures enclosed show his babbitt, engine was loaded with "Time saver"

When I had initially commented back in 2006 in forum everyone was jumping on us that we were attacking him as Foye was the end all to Model T rebuilding.
As then as now I am showing the true light of what it is.
Before someone else falls for it and gets a painful lesson in a pile of engine parts that don't work.

[Gen3AntiqueAuto]

Of course this took an ugly turn, my COMPETITION J&M is "this close" to being sued for libel - repeating the LIES that Luchetti started. So lets clear the air.

The photo of the block with all the holes in it. That was run in a test stand on video prior to being picked up. Would it run with holes in it and all apart? no.... The owner decided to "check my work" by tearing the engine 100% apart before it even left the bed of his truck. He then decided to "clean it" with a sandblaster and blew out all the brass from a very nice block repair, all the babbit, everything. Another "useful idiot" like J&M decided to LIE about me and tell the world that "that's how Tim returned it". He's since apologized for the lies.

A D-B called Luchetti, whom everyone warned me is a backstabber, after I completed multiple car restorations and bragged about my work - got a call from my ex-wife or a minion who told him "Tim's getting divorced and your cars there are going to be seized as his assets". That's his "hunch" that he should pull the cars from my shop. He lied on arrival here "decided to hold off on the restoration" and took the UNDONE engines to J&M, lied to them about them. On top of all that, he sold a friend of mine an engine "that Tim restored" that blew up. We dug into that and found the engine was restored poorly by someone else. This turd on the lawn of the Model T Hobby is to this day still lying about me, despite the prize winning restorations I had done for him in the past.

As for the transmission - I heated the drum, did you watch the video? Parts were cleaned (boring) off camera. Measurements were taken off camera, and FYI - the number of spacers that came off = the number that need to go back on. It's not rocket science. If you want 100% EVERYTHING done on engines I can do that too - no one will watch them so you get highlights and tips.

[Gen3AntiqueAuto]

One more thing because I am tired of people lying about me and my work for revenge against their imagined slights (Luchetti) or to get my customers to drop me and go to them (J&M) - and it's always the same two people..... 14 freaking years and no end in sight to the same lies from these two idiots!

Timesaver - developed by the US navy. Cuts babbit only (soft metals) to 0.0015 and STOPS. I don't care how much of this stuff is in an engine, it will not cut past 0.0015". Will not cut steel.
Did I miss some in an obscure crevice when I cleaned it - maybe.
Does it matter? NO.
Was it grey? NO - that's babbit and cast iron seating itself in. Timesaver is yellow.

Every engine seats itself in after a rebuild. If you don't have "grey stuff" in your oil to remove with an oil change or two, your rings didn't seat.

This is how my engines run when they leave here: https://youtu.be/AzqHjvfejSc
What you do to it after it leaves is on you, not me.

Everything done here is done on camera, partly because of the aforemention idiots. The "boring", the "pauses", and the allergy sniffs are clipped out so I don't lose my audience. If you think I film an engine running in a car or stand and chop it up or fill it with dirt before I send it home, you're delusional.

[ModelTWoods]

GEE, I hope this is the end of this thread ! ! ! Getting back to Tim's original question of this thread about the feasibility of stocking rebuilt short blocks: He said it best in his last thread; "What ever you do with it after it leaves, is on you, not me".

[J and M Machine]

Tim Foye: Please elaborate where we are libeling you?
I am taking from your words on this forum that you have a small space to work in with a 30 amp service.
Let's see the pictures that you can say we are your competitor ,what are you competing against?

I don't know where you even begin to think we are as you state "COMPETITOR" as we are a full machine shop and you?

What I posted along with pictures were from two independent people around the same year .

Do you mean to say they lied for us ?

By you name calling me rather than stating facts is just a poor argument that you've already lost.

[J and M Machine]

GEE, I hope this is the end of this thread ! ! ! Getting back to Tim's original question of this thread about the feasibility of stocking rebuilt short blocks: He said it best in his last thread; "What ever you do with it after it leaves, is on you, not me".

Feasibility to stock Model T engines or any engine that is antique is a non starter as everyone wan't something different.
Different year, different pistons, different cam . Remember we are talking about Model T engines.
Model T engines and customers have been slowly fading away ,
storing an engine is not a good business model for a perspective customer to come calling.

[Gen3AntiqueAuto]

The difference between me and J&M is I have had two or possibly three of their F-ups come into my shop to be fixed after the customer was not happy at all with the crap job they did.

I did not once flame them on the internet.

This is going on 15 years of these two jealous idiots torching me for the same one engine that the customer ruined with a sandblaster. All just trying to defame me to get more business. The joke is there are plenty of jobs out there - I don't need to flame them to get work, but apparently they feel threatened by my presence so they lie about me.

[ModelTWoods]

Will it ever end? The "better man" needs to drop out of this thread, and by doing so, show everyone that they are the "better man". I don't have "a dog in this fight", but enough is enough. A man's character is best shown by his deeds; not his words.

[RGould1910]

Tim, Im glad you cleared it up that you heated the disc drum and thats the reason it slid easily on the transmission shaft, as well as cleaning the parts off camera.

I still think its neceaary to check the thrust washer clearance, though. Relying on the set screw to set the distance is not the way to go for a number of reasons ie wear on the brake drum, an enlarged hole in the transmission shaft, loose threads on the set screw or the disc drum. If any machining was done on the vertical flange surface of the transmission shaft would be another reason that comes to mind.

[RGould1910]

After rereading your text, I think you believe that replacing the three trust washers with the correct thicknesses, that alone will insure the correct clearance if the set screw enters the hole in the trans shaft. Not true. Surprisingly the clearance can be out of spec even though the set screw enters the hole. I move the brake drum back and forth after the washers. disc drum are installed and see how much movement I have before inserting the set screw.
Its not hard using a dial indicator. After you set the clearance insert the set screw and wrap wire thu the holes and around the hub and cinch it up by twisting the wire. Cotter pins arent as good. Ive seen loose set screws using cotter pins.

[Greg sarky k]

Tim,



I think to just make wildly unsubstantiated statements without any evidence of the accusation, that is dangerous folly.

Tim, if you have proof of what you are saying ,then post it. Do as the others do with photos and explanations.
From what I see is that you have dissed or possibly slandered both Mr Luchetti and J and M Machine. Both Luchetti and J and M Machine have highly successful businesses. Luchetti has a long standing complete auto servicing company and J and M Machine is nationally respected machine shop and are highly respected engine builders. It’s difficult for me to believe that anyone would come to you with a faltering engine that was rebuilt by J and M . They stand by all their work and have a million dollars worth of equipment,top tier equipment that enables the builder,with their knowledge to produce the best result time and time again.

As I understand it, you are set up as essentially as a hobbyist . I don’t denigrate that as my own dad was a hobbyist who could do rebuilds on a pro level.

So if you do have the evidence of what you say,you should produce it. Otherwise Tim, I fear you will be making a great headache for yourself..