Old Wives Tales VS Ford Methods and Materials

[Humblej]

Having been a model T owner for 50 years, most of my life, I have had to endure the general public's misconceptions, cliches, and old wives tales. We have all heard them, and some are so ingrained in public knowledge that some of us, myself included, have repeated them...all model T's were painted black, you can do any repair with a pair of plyers and bailing wire, etc, etc, etc. Every year I see some of the same topics discussed and yet again beaten to death, water pumps, oak spokes, best oil, etc. Sometimes I ignore, sometimes I respond, sometimes I vent. I feel there is a lot of combined wisdom and experience on this site, I have learned a lot, and have tried to pass my limited knowledge on as well. That being said, I am taken aback by those who do not know but are anxious to share their lack of knowledge with others, in short, to perpetuate the old wives tales. Furthermore, I believe passing along wrong information, guesses, and old wives tales to new model T owners is a disservice. Also there are a few among us that are just looking for a straight line so they can respond with a wise crack, again not helpful to a new model T owner needing advice or help.

The Model T was indeed built quickly and inexpensively, but in no way was it built in a slipshod manner with no tolerances or quality control. The factory drawing for the crankshaft pulley pin is dimensioned to 3 decimal points, just for a lousy pin. Yes it makes a difference to set the valve timing to optimal, the coil adjusted to optimal, the rear end gear lash to optimal, etc, just as it makes a difference to drive the model T setting the carb mixture to optimal, setting the spark lever to optimal, shifting into and out of low speed optimally. The model T cannot give good service or reasonable performance by setting spark plug gap, coil points, etc, by eye or by sound. The idea that the Model T was made for farmers to adjust to a general setting by sight goes against the Ford Service Manual, and the Ford Service Bulletins by letter and spirit. Setting coil points by sight and sound is not the way Ford did it, yes it does make a difference, and given the poor performance of a model T engine there is very little room with cutting corners and thereby shaving horsepower.

We should all strive to respond to questions with wisdom and experience, not best guesses or old wives tails. We should all, myself included, re-read our advice and think twice before clicking submit. Is it fact or opinion, guess or know, actual experience or something that might work.

[John Codman]

I don't disagree with the above, but I think that bringing up the same subjects periodically is helpful. Newer members will not have seen a discussion that took place even six months ago, and speaking only for myself, I haven't had a lot of luck with the search function.

[Scott_Conger]

John

using any internet search engine and typing "MTFCA your subject here" will bring up tons of pertinent info
using the forum's search engine and typing "your subject here" will bring up something. Maybe.

[TXGOAT2]

Most general maintenence on a T is well within the abilities of a pre-1930s farmer. Proper coil adjustment is probably the most difficult to accomplish under the shade tree. Many thousands of farmers operated hit/miss type engines, kerosene stoves, lanterns, forges, and other devices which gave them some background in combustion dynamics and in basic I/C behavior. I'd guess that the percentage of everyday automobile drivers today who have no clue whatever about how their vehicle operates is greater today than it was in 1920.

[Steve Jelf]

I will state an opinion, cite personal experience, or make a guess. But I try to identify my remarks as such. Some folks, especially in the FB T groups, falsely think I know a lot because I often look up the answers online or in books.

[JTT3]

I understand the gist of the OP however let’s look at what is really happening with repeated post. It’s building Esprit de corps. 40 years for me more for others and for the new life blood the chance to build the relationship embodied in Esprit de corps for our beloved Model T. For me in my dotage I realize that our colors fade for lack of wearer’s metaphorically speaking. Maybe even in my lifetime there could be huge restrictions on the use of our vehicles. I hope not! The trend and involvement in pre 1930 cars has diminished many if not most of us are trying in our own ways to recruit new folks into the hobby but it may not be enough. All that said can I disregard the here we go again thoughts of questions that have been asked into infinity & socially try to help those less informed, why yes. It’s the dialogue that helps bond us. From the oft asked questions & discussions innovation has happened, work arounds have been discussed and implemented. In most cases once vetted for the good of our hobby. I encourage the debate & questions no matter how old or repetitive, it demonstrates interest and learning. It doesn’t mean we won’t get frustrated with the repeats however it does mean someone cares and is asking for help. We discourage this then we will be folding our own tents and the discussion side of the forum becomes a ghost town. Again I get it but gladly tolerate it vs the other scenarios. I hope all will follow suit. Kindest and respect to all, best regards John

[Mark Gregush]

One of my drafting instructors had a saying; It is not WHAT you know, but KNOWING where to find the information. I too, often look in my library to make sure the information I post is correct.

[Been Here Before]

Nothing more satisfying than having a stack of books to look up an answer to a question.

The internet is OK.

But owing a book with an answer is more satisfying.

[John kuehn]

I have to agree with the idea of instruction manuals, books about T’s and etc is probably the best overall source of information about Model T’s. And yes show and tell videos on the internet can really help a lot.
What I’ve learned over the years from the information that’s available is great. While following the Ford service manual in general is good and it will lead you in the right direction to get a repairs done the shortcuts and different approaches that others have used are sometimes better.
Yes folks Ford had a good idea overall but every once in a while a better idea does come along to make working on and improving T’s that’s really helpful.
I’ve always believed it’s good to know WHAT NOT TO DO is just as important as knowing what to do. And you learn that by reading and seeing all the information you can get.

In reality Ford built the Model T for the masses. His market was to the common man and primarily not to well to do people who primarily who were better off and more educated.

The common man were usually farmers, laborers, and not as well educated and not engineers with access to the modern equipment at the time.
So what did the common man do to keep his Model T going? He fixed it the best way he could with what he had which usually were common tools he used in his trade or farm.
He learned along the way probably using a Ford service manual if he could read and learning from others to keep his car going. That was Fords genius when he built a car that was fairly simple. Average folks with common sense could learn to work on it.

To this day the term ‘ farm fix’ is come to be thought of as a derogatory term used by self appointed engineers and professional tire kickers.
It’s amazing to see those old and heavily used T’s in pictures that were still going after been used and sometimes abused for so many years.

[MichaelPawelek]

The great thing about the forum is that I can ask a question while I am actually under a Model T working on a particular part and get both right and wrong answers within minutes…

[JohnM]

Mr Jelf, you DO know a lot. And you share it with sincere humility as do many others on this site. I don't come here just to ask questions or to answer others. For those who get frustrated, you are missing the real reason we are here.

[perry kete]

I don't mind those who ask questions over and over because every day is a new learning experience.

Sometimes those who are new don't know that the books are available or haven't learned about our great vendors.

We old farts were raised on books because that's all we had available but the young folks of today were raised on computers and cell phones and have been taught to do their research on the internet.

[Scott_Conger]

I fear that one day far into the future, an archeologist and historian will be sifting through the rubble that once was civilization and the archeologist will unearth a buzz-box and the historian will read the period instructions claiming 50% increase in mileage and improved reliability and exclaim "I KNEW it!"

[Kaiser]

I was a newby myself in a not so distant past, although a trained ships engineer and later trained gun smith for almost 25years, i discovered i had to 'un-learn' a lot of the knowledge about cars that was completely different than the way Henry Ford did it.
Thanks to the very patient members of this forum i found my way around the 'T quircks' and the proper books to help with the right info.
For every T related question there was always a member to give his time and knowledge freely to help me along.
I hope it stays that way for future T owners, this forum is quite unique on the interwebs, few places are as friendly and welcoming AND as knowledgable these days.
Thank you all for that !

[Original Smith]

I agree with the first post. I have been into Model T's for over 60 years, and am still learning. I've been called an expert by some, and hate that term. Why? because I'm still learning after all this time. The key here, is research, and not believing everything your hear.

[OilyBill]

I have to highly commend the Ford Model T Club Magazine for their really excellent articles! One that comes to mind is one that was done on the factory painting of the Model T. It explained virtually EVERYTHING about Model T factory paint, and even gave the formulas for the paint! I LOVE articles like that! They give you REAL, DEEP information that is based on the original documents from the factory. There is no need for fables and folklore if you can find out the true facts of the matter at hand.
Also, owning other makes of early cars, I think Model T enthusiasts are not properly grateful for the HUGE amount of available, documented information on their cars.
I wish I had as good of information for my Brush or my Overland, as what the Model T Club has available for its members!