Engine hood not sitting well

[rainer]

Hello.
I kindly want to ask what I can do, the engine hood is not following well the shape of the radiator.

When I got my Lizzy, the steel rod on top was rusted in. This I could solve, I turned the rod left and right until I could pull it out. Then I sanded it,applied a bit of grease as rust protection, and re-inserted it. It still goes a bit hard, but it does not stick any more.
The paintwork at upper joint is also flaking off a bit besides the loops because there was a lot of filler used and simply painted over. But it was too high, co it was partially scraped off by the other half of the engine hood. This will need some more work, I am afraid.

Also the engine hood is not following the shape of radiator very well. Where it is bent approx 45degrees, it does not sit well, it is not bent sufficiently. It is reaching out 1/4" over radiator shape.
Looking to the inner side, I see a stripe of leather. It is hard as concrete, was painted over by the former owner with car paint. I have no pictures yet, but this weekend I can take some. At the moment I can only show a very blurry one, but I am very sure that this problem is well known.

Here the engine hood stands off

On above picture you can see where the engine hood stands off. To fix this, I will have to bend the sheet metal of all four parts a bit more. This makes me nervous. I can use a piece of 1 1/2" or 2" pipe place the sheets on it, and then bend, but it can (and probably will) happen that the paint will flake off (together with this "high quality" filler underneath). Also, there is a holding clamp riveted to the upper parts of the hood inside, holding the super-hard and soaked in black paint leather stripe, so the engine hood will not be laying well on the pipe at all.

I will also need to remove the old leather. It is so hard that it is galling the radiator's brass. It needs to be replaced by something new (either leather or a stripe of black rubber. But how do I get new leather under the holding clamp? I am scared that prying it up is the wrong way, it will not return t its current position. I also cannot hammer it down, this can damage the outer paint, too. Pulling the old leather seems to be possible.

Suggestions?

I know the hard way: Pull the old leather, pry up the holding clamp a little bit to make new leather slide in easily, bend the hood into correct shape (hereby possibly causing cracks in paint), then completely repaint it, and finally glue in new leather (instead of hammering down the holding clamps).
But if possible, I would like to do it less destructively.

[MichaelPawelek]

There is the possibility that the hood does not sit correct because the frame is sagging.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

I think your distortion is probably more concentrated to the front couple of inches of the hood? If so, can you simply "adjust" the hood by hand, carefully reversing the bends? If not, placing a flat piece of hard wood under the bent area and carefully hammering the raised area down with a plastic hammer may help some. In addition to the plastic hammer, smear some oil on the surface of the hood. This will help to preserve the paint. Still, no guarantees with regard to paint or filler preservation. You might also try placing a piece of hard wood on each side of the hood and clamping the hood edge flat. The metal may simply spring back, but it may be worth a try.

Of course, there is always the option of a new hood... If you have repaint things anyway, might be best to paint a new hood.

[Norman Kling]

There is a possibility that the hood and radiator are not of the same year car, or that one or both are reproductions and the dimensions are not quite right. If the hood would fit the top of the radiator, but it hits the hood sills at the bottom, before it is all the way down, you might try some thick leather strips under the radiator to raise it a bit. If the shape does not fit on top, you will either need to find a radiator to fit or replace with a hood which fits. Otherwise do as suggested above and try to bend the hood to fit.
Norm

[rainer]

Jerry, you are right. The distortion is primarily on first inches.
The hood is not sitting on the hood sills, it hangs approx 5-8 mm above. So the lower end is fine.
So I will try to carefully bend the hood more.

So I will try to bend the hood-bends stronger, this will bring the secondary joint behind the radiator shape. At the moment the bends are not enough and therefore lifting the secondary joints.

Any suggestions with this super-hard paint-soaked leather? How to get a new one into the clamp?


Rainer

[Sarikatime]

Rainer, if you apply some petroleum jelly or some cooking oil on the hood and the new leather it will possibly squeez in. Only use a rubber hammer when working on the hood. Most hoods on the model T’s are somewhat bent up like yours and if it doesn’t bother you, drive it the way it is, there isn’t enough people that are familiar with the model T in Vienna to know the difference.
The seminar on the coils that I told you about was cancelled due to 12 inches of snow last night, so I will video tape it when it gets rescheduled. I found some very good information and explanations of coil testing and adjusting on this website in one of the threads. Look for it and have fun reading. Lot of good information that you are looking for.
I might see you again this summer.
Frank

[david_dewey]

I would suggest you get a sharp, thin putty knife and "slip" it under the leather (between hood metal and leather) to free it from the paint and likely rust under the leather. Then slip it under the retaining metal to free it from it and the rust that is likely under there. It won't be easy, but you should be able to pull it out then--you might have to take a small screwdriver at one end of the retaining piece and slip it in the end of the leather and the retaining piece and start prying it out gently--you are trying to lever it out but not distort the metal. The new leather will be softer, depending on the tanning process used, and will change how the hood fits. Note that leather usually shrinks and hardens when exposed to water-it probably wasn't the best choice for this use! I am wondering if frame webbing would be better??
Let us know how it goes. I suspect you really need to strip this hood and repaint it, this time without gobs of filler!

[rainer]

Hello, Frank,
thank you for writing.

Rainer, if you apply some petroleum jelly or some cooking oil on the hood and the new leather it will possibly squeeze in. Only use a rubber hammer when working on the hood. Most hoods on the model T’s are somewhat bent up like yours and if it doesn’t bother you, drive it the way it is, there isn’t enough people that are familiar with the model T in Vienna to know the difference.

Getting the old leather out does not appear to be a problem. It is sitting partially loose below the retainers, it is is only super-hard and ugly. I can grip it with strong self-locking welding pliers and then pull it out. After that I can repaint the hood from inner side when needed. Your idea with petroleum jelly is good. Wouldn't some technical grease (of course not a black one) or soaking the new leather in engine oil be even better? It will make the leather softer and hydrophobic over longer time.
After replacing the leather, I will see if the hood fits better to the radiator. Possibly I can bend it a bit more over my thumbs. This sheet metal is relatively thin but the inner retainer for leather stiffens it. perhaps it needs a little over-bending to fit when it partially springs back afterwards. But I will not do too much, the paintwork could get cracks hereby, and I will do that after a drive, then the hood is warm and the paintwork is more flexible..

The seminar on the coils that I told you about was cancelled due to 12 inches of snow last night, so I will video tape it when it gets rescheduled. I found some very good information and explanations of coil testing and adjusting on this website in one of the threads. Look for it and have fun reading. Lot of good information that you are looking for.
I might see you again this summer.
Frank

I already received a lot of useful information here (thanks to all!), but if you have video taped the seminar (and it is not really a video tape but digitally recorded), I will be happy if you could make it available to me.

If you visit again next summer (let's see what COVID sais...) please let me know earlier. I will participate first time the summer travel of "Alpenchapter Bavaria Model T Club" https://alpenchapter.com/, I hope this will be at a different time. They have three drives every year, in spring, summer (the big one), and autumn. But summer one is not scheduled yet. I would enjoy if we can do a little drive with my Lizzy. It is located close to Eisenstadt (close to Hungary, Sopron), so we have to move over there first in my car.
It would be wonderful if we can meet again.