Mounting engine splash pans

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes, that way when you do criticize them, you're a mile away and
you have their shoes!

John,

I would also add, that if you build a man fire, you'll warm him for a day. However, if you set that man on fire, you'll warm him for the rest of his life.

[speedytinc]

Yes this has been a long thread...but it has added some clarity to the operation of the thermosyphon system.

With that, I am hazarding a guess that the introduction of the water pump to the Model T was a result of a mechanic removing the engine pans---disrupting the thermosyphon air flow and causing the cars with out the pans to over heat. Rather than replacing the pans, a mechanic looked at the 1908 design with water pump and decided that a water pump was a solution to an over heating Model T.

I must have missed something here.
Was a definitive conclusion reached? Was some industry engineering reasoning found?
Has it been determined that pans DO contribute to cooling Or are the pans designed to protect the motor from debris?
Is it both? Is it not important to know, since all T's came with them? Henry knows best.
The efficacy of the extra transmission pans were obviously determined unimportant based on their discontinuance.

[Been Here Before]

And from the United States Patent Office for 1907:


J. A. MILLER.
UNDER PAN FOR AUTOMOBILES. ( https://patents.google.com/patent/US925783A/en)

Under-Pans for Automobiles, of which the following is a specification.

"My invention relates to an under pan adapted to be attached to automobiles for the purpose of protecting the motor and working parts from dust, water or mud, thereby `keeping' said parts clean and free from any foreign matter, in consequence of which the various parts will be longer lived and at the same time the best power output in dusty or ,'wet weather will be obtained. "

And in 1909
W. H. MULLINS. AUTOMOBILE DUST PAN. APPLICATION IILBD JULY 8, 1909.
971,550., Patented 0013.4,1910.

[TXGOAT2]

BOTH, much as the hood protects against rain while improving overall aerodynamics and airflow through the radiator, assuming a front-mounted radiator) I doubt if Mr. Mullins gave any thought to airflow management, but early lessons learned in aviation and auto racing soon made its importance clear to motor vehicle designers. Some very early cars would have made good drag chutes, and they must have been a handful in a headwind. Aero drag goes up very rapidly as speed increases, and the amount of power required to push vehicle through the air at higher speeds also increases rapidly. A little thought given to airflow management can yield significant improvements in performance and the efficacy of automotive cooling systems.

[jiminbartow]

The purpose of the forum is not necessarily to form absolute conclusions based upon the scientific method, which requires rigid experimentation, but to provide as much general information, ideas and opinions, as possible, allowing the reader to use his own common sense, experience and deductive reasoning to arrive at his own conclusions, based upon the power and persuasiveness of the argument. Regarding “engine pans”, I have arrived at my own conclusions, deduced from the opinions put forth in this thread that “engine pans” are essential for all the reasons Pat has posted. Jim Patrick

[speedytinc]

And from the United States Patent Office for 1907:


J. A. MILLER.
UNDER PAN FOR AUTOMOBILES. ( https://patents.google.com/patent/US925783A/en)

Under-Pans for Automobiles, of which the following is a specification.

"My invention relates to an under pan adapted to be attached to automobiles for the purpose of protecting the motor and working parts from dust, water or mud, thereby `keeping' said parts clean and free from any foreign matter, in consequence of which the various parts will be longer lived and at the same time the best power output in dusty or ,'wet weather will be obtained. "

And in 1909
W. H. MULLINS. AUTOMOBILE DUST PAN. APPLICATION IILBD JULY 8, 1909.
971,550., Patented 0013.4,1910.

Thank you for the research involved here.

As stated pans were to keep stuff out of the motor. That was crucial to the life of a motor on the primitive roads @ the time.
I can believe this. In fact, on a cross country tour, one T picked up a 1/4" nut into the carb off the highway. It sucked up & lodged under an intake valve seat. No engine pans.

As far as helping the cooling system, absent concrete evidence, my OPINION is pans were not considered important to cooling. There may be a negligible advantage.
Evidence: Ford was quick to unseal the system with hood louvers for the sake of the horn's new location under the hood.
Must not have been important for directed air flow.
Aerodynamics are barely in play with an automobile traveling dirt roads @ 20 mph. They are a barn door.
Racers are an obvious exception @ hi speed.

I much prefer facts to answer a question. A bunch of unsubstantiated opinions, including my own mean much less. I prefer to form my conclusions regarding a matter based in facts.
There is no consensus in "science", unless we are talking about the global warming fraud or the global cooling fraud before it or the renewable energy fraud draining our wallets currently.

Not to say I dont enjoy the conversation, the wide diversity of experiences have a unique value in this hobby.
Whats wrong with absolute conclusions? Judging standards are a mass of absolute conclusions until proven otherwise. Then the new standard is fact.
But, striving for truth is the goal.

[JTT3]

There is a 2 post minimum on this Topic so for everyone that hasn’t posted yet please do we’ve got plenty of room.

[TXGOAT2]

Most of the warm air from the engine compartment on my '26''27 T passes out the back of the engine compartment and under the car. The result is about the same with the engine stopped while hot, or with the engine idling while hot. Some heated air escapes at the louvers, but the majority of the volume of heated air goes under the car. This can be confirmed using a large shop fan set directly in front of the car to generate a good breeze. A lot of heated air can be felt at the back of the car, and a much lesser volume along and just behind the hood louvers.

[Carl]

OK,OK,,,,,,Y’all convinced me …….!!!!
I just ,,two days ago ,,took the driver’s side off …..
I don’t have the one for the passenger side ,,,so I guess I’ll be on the lookout for a ‘26 passenger side one ….
I wonder how I got along all these years ,,without ‘em……
Just getting this ‘26 on the road ….All my other T’s n TTs never had them …Meaning nobody had put then back on ,,and were Long Gone …