Bottom bracket bushing

Discuss all things Model T related.
Forum rules
If you need help logging in, or have question about how something works, use the Support forum located here Support Forum
Complete set of Forum Rules Forum Rules

Topic author
Lexveen
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:18 pm
First Name: Lex
Last Name: Veen
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Touring
Location: Zoetermeer Zuid-Holland

Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Lexveen » Tue Oct 15, 2024 2:39 am

Curiosity or not? I pulled a steering column from a ‘25 Pickup (an original one with steel bed!) to rebuild it. At the bottom bracket it had a huge play. As I use to do, I hacksawd the bushings and knocked the bottom one out. The upper one however did not want to come out. After several attempts and cleaning to bare metal with brake cleaner, the bushing stayed dark. Could find any brass colour and…. it turned out there is no bushing there. The bearing is plane cast iron. I searched the forum, found several topics about the bushings, but all brackets had two bushings.
Was this some kind of cost saving experiment by Ford?
Because there is no big radial force, plane cast iron will work when new, but when the bearing is shot (it is bigger now than 3/4 and a bit oval shaped) you need a bushing there. So I think about turning it out on a lathe to 7/8 and press a brass bushing in. Any suggestions?
Attachments
IMG_0078.jpeg
IMG_0080.jpeg
IMG_0081.jpeg


RVA23T
Posts: 834
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2022 8:27 am
First Name: Richard
Last Name: C
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1923 Touring
Location: Lake Country, Virginia

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by RVA23T » Tue Oct 15, 2024 6:03 am

Only 1 bushing used after 1921.
Everything works in theory.
Reality is how you determine if something works or not.


Jerry VanOoteghem
Posts: 4082
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 4:06 pm
First Name: Jerry
Last Name: Van
Location: S.E. Michigan

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Jerry VanOoteghem » Tue Oct 15, 2024 6:24 am

RVA23T wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2024 6:03 am
Only 1 bushing used after 1921.
Correct. Only one bushing.


Topic author
Lexveen
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:18 pm
First Name: Lex
Last Name: Veen
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Touring
Location: Zoetermeer Zuid-Holland

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Lexveen » Tue Oct 15, 2024 8:30 am

I did my ‘26 Touring last year and there were 2 bushings. If one bushing is there, dus the shaft run free in the top or acts the cast iron hole a second bearing?

User avatar

DanTreace
Posts: 3812
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:56 am
First Name: Dan
Last Name: Treace
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: ‘12 open express,'23 cutoff, '27 touring
Location: North Central FL
Board Member Since: 2000
Contact:

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by DanTreace » Tue Oct 15, 2024 8:48 am

Later steering brackets only have lower bushing. And late ‘25-‘27 use a larger o.d. Bushing.

The upper is free space, helps hold more grease, be sure to install the felt grease seal in the upper groove.
The best way is always the simplest. The attics of the world are cluttered up with complicated failures. Henry Ford
Don’t find fault, find a remedy; anybody can complain. Henry Ford


OlGeezer
Posts: 22
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:50 pm
First Name: Andrew
Last Name: Turner
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1922 Runabout
Location: Williamsburg, Virginia

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by OlGeezer » Tue Oct 15, 2024 12:18 pm

Brass will definitely hold up better than cast iron. Just make sure the dimensions are spot on, and maybe add a lubrication groove to help it last longer.


Topic author
Lexveen
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:18 pm
First Name: Lex
Last Name: Veen
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Touring
Location: Zoetermeer Zuid-Holland

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Lexveen » Tue Oct 15, 2024 12:38 pm

I continued the rebuild today. I tried to enlarge the upper diameter in the bracket to install an upper bushing, but on closer inspection that appears to be impossible, because the hole of the greasecup is 1/4 from the upper edge. So one bushing it will be. Reaming to the correct diameter is much easier, because you don’t have to worry about reaming two bushings in line. Ford was clever😏


Allan
Posts: 6609
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:21 pm
First Name: Allan
Last Name: Bennett
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1912 van, 1917 shooting brake, 1929 roadster buckboard, 1924 tourer, 1925 barn find buckboard, 1925 D &F wide body roadster, 1927LHD Tudor sedan.
Location: Gawler, Australia

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Allan » Tue Oct 15, 2024 6:57 pm

Lex, reaming the bush to the"correct" size may not be the best way to go. Most steering shafts are worn to some degree where they run in the bushing in the bracket. leaving a ridge of original diameter between the wear and the pitman arm.
There is a way to improve things. If you withdraw the steering shaft, that unworn ridge can be machined down somewhat. Just don't go berserk in this, or the taper that takes the pitman arm will be reduced in length. Then ream the bush to an absolute very neat fit, enough to go on over the newly machined section, leaving as much of the bushing intact as you can. That way you will achieve the best fit over the worn section of shaft as can be had without fitting a new shaft.

Hope this helps.
Allan from down under.


OilyBill
Posts: 641
Joined: Sat Apr 25, 2020 3:51 pm
First Name: William
Last Name: May
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914 Runabout
Location: Tucson, Arizona

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by OilyBill » Wed Oct 16, 2024 2:49 am

I vote for Allan-From-Down-Under's advice!


Stephen_heatherly
Posts: 386
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:03 pm
First Name: Stephen
Last Name: Heatherly
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 26 coupe and 23 Runabout
Location: St. Louis MO

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Stephen_heatherly » Wed Oct 16, 2024 8:36 am

Turn the shaft until it is round again on the bushing end and make an undersize bushing to match.

Stephen


Topic author
Lexveen
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:18 pm
First Name: Lex
Last Name: Veen
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Touring
Location: Zoetermeer Zuid-Holland

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Lexveen » Wed Oct 16, 2024 10:28 am

That is exactly what I did. I turned down the shaft just enough to get a good round surface (not too much to limit loss of the cone) and reamed the bushing that much the bracket could just be turned by hand. So thanks and we agree on that.

I wondered about one other thing: what gives the best lubrication? Grease or W600? Pressing the grease in with the little greasecup gives good lubrication for the coming 50 miles or so, but then it will be dry again. Grease does not run and the geease in the space above the bushing stays where it is. If I fill up the space above the bushing with thick W600, it will slowly run down the groove in the bushing and keeps it wet. What do you think?

User avatar

DanTreace
Posts: 3812
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:56 am
First Name: Dan
Last Name: Treace
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: ‘12 open express,'23 cutoff, '27 touring
Location: North Central FL
Board Member Since: 2000
Contact:

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by DanTreace » Wed Oct 16, 2024 11:35 am

Use grease, the grease will dissolve slowly to run down the steering shaft. Re-pack according to Ford Owner's Manual chart, every 500 or so miles.

Oil, like 600W will just weep too fast, and make a mess, besides, the steering shaft isn't spinning at speed.

Pack the grease cup with your favorite axle grease, IMO, red grease is best. Marine white grease will cake up.

IMG_7759.jpeg
IMG_7758.jpeg
The best way is always the simplest. The attics of the world are cluttered up with complicated failures. Henry Ford
Don’t find fault, find a remedy; anybody can complain. Henry Ford

User avatar

Oldav8tor
Posts: 2245
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:39 am
First Name: Tim
Last Name: Juhl
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1917 Touring
Location: Thumb of Michigan
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Oldav8tor » Wed Oct 16, 2024 8:20 pm

We recently dealt with a steering shaft from a single bushing bracket where the steering shaft was worn and "ovaled". We turned the shaft down enough to make it round again and replaced the bushing with one that had a smaller ID that was then reamed to size.

We ordered the following from Grainger: Item13T607 - BUNTING Sleeve Bearing - 11/16 in Bore, 1 in OD, 1 1/4 in Lg,
1917 Touring
1946 Aeronca Champ
1952 Willys M38a1 Jeep (sold 2023)
1953 Ford Jubilee Tractor


Original Smith
Posts: 3699
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:43 am
First Name: Larry
Last Name: Smith
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 13 Touring, 13 Roadster, 17 Coupelet, 25 Roadster P/U
Location: Lomita, California
MTFCA Life Member: YES

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Original Smith » Thu Oct 17, 2024 12:17 am

Good to find this out. The real early T's use one bushing too, except it is the full length of the bracket.


Topic author
Lexveen
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2023 1:18 pm
First Name: Lex
Last Name: Veen
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 Touring
Location: Zoetermeer Zuid-Holland

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Lexveen » Thu Oct 17, 2024 2:03 am

I could reach a decent roundness at 18,2 mm, which is lightly larger than 11/16.
The bushing I made was 35 mm long and the max length that fits the bracket, which is 1 3/8.
Maybe w600 in winter and grease in summer?

User avatar

Oldav8tor
Posts: 2245
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:39 am
First Name: Tim
Last Name: Juhl
* REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1917 Touring
Location: Thumb of Michigan
Board Member Since: 2018

Re: Bottom bracket bushing

Post by Oldav8tor » Fri Oct 18, 2024 8:33 pm

I did the unthinkable - in my two-bushing bracket I replaced the upper grease cup with a grease zerk and drilled and tapped the lower bushing to install another. I grease with Timken bearing grease - it seems to do a good job.
1917 Touring
1946 Aeronca Champ
1952 Willys M38a1 Jeep (sold 2023)
1953 Ford Jubilee Tractor

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic