Front axle rebuild questions

[LittleTimmy52]

I want to do a front axle rebuild, what all do I need parts wise to do the job? I plan to take apart the front axle and spring , along with the front wheels. I know I need graphite and bushings, but I do not know what else I need. are there any remove and replace items like some washer or cover or something? what are the little things often overlooked? what special tools do I need? (I know there's some reamers drivers and pullers out there).

Thanks.

[NY John T]

First get the club's front and rear axle book from the vendors. John

[TRDxB2]

I want to do a front axle rebuild, what all do I need parts wise to do the job? I plan to take apart the front axle and spring , along with the front wheels. I know I need graphite and bushings, but I do not know what else I need. are there any remove and replace items like some washer or cover or something? what are the little things often overlooked? what special tools do I need? (I know there's some reamers drivers and pullers out there).

Thanks.

Graphite? No you want to get some graphite base paint. Aerosol is all you need for the spring top & undersides.
You should consider all the parts related to steering nit just the front axle
If you redo the spindle bushings you'll need special tools. Spindles bolts needed with new bushings.
Start looking at the ball of the pit man arm, tie rod & even the wishbone for wear. Shackles & Tie rod bolts: their bushings too.Don't forget the steering bracket bushing. Sometimes over looked is the steering gear cover underside.
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[LittleTimmy52]

Quick question, my shackles they look like 1923 based off new ones from langs, but I got a 1917, do the style shackles matter? Or is it just a shape?

Also I hope shackles good because that price tag is steep.

[LittleTimmy52]

I want to do a front axle rebuild, what all do I need parts wise to do the job? I plan to take apart the front axle and spring , along with the front wheels. I know I need graphite and bushings, but I do not know what else I need. are there any remove and replace items like some washer or cover or something? what are the little things often overlooked? what special tools do I need? (I know there's some reamers drivers and pullers out there).

Thanks.

Graphite? No you want to get some graphite base paint. Aerosol is all you need for the spring top & undersides.
You should consider all the parts related to steering nit just the front axle
If you redo the spindle bushings you'll need special tools. Spindles bolts needed with new bushings.
Start looking at the ball of the pit man arm, tie rod & even the wishbone for wear. Shackles & Tie rod bolts: their bushings too.Don't forget the steering bracket bushing. Sometimes over looked is the steering gear cover underside.
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Thanks, I'll look into steering as well I guess since you are right I might as well. But I do know one of my drag links and pitman arm are fine since I replaced those a few months ago

[John kuehn]

First thing to do would be to jack up your front end on either side and determine what has any movement in ALL the moving parts. Use the steering wheel and slowly move it back and forth with all the weight off the wheels. You’ll be surprised what’s worn when you thought it wasn’t!
Once you determine what needs to be replaced remove the wheels, remove the front axle assembly and place it on your work bench.
It’s a lot easier to dissemble and replace all the bushings, tie rod parts and etc by doing it this way! Yes you can do it on the car but it’s harder to do and harder to get to. Good luck!

[Steve Jelf]

Get the Axle book.

https://mtfca.square.site/product/servi ... se&q=false

[Dan Hatch]

Find someone with a Stevens Front axle tool.
Here is a link to a video of the tool in action.
Many thanks to Bill R for recording it and posting it on YouTube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DNGT7P79vg

[Ron Patterson]

FIRST!
Find someone who has Model T Ford front axle alignment fixture, knows how to use it and get your hundred year old axle properly aligned.
"Today Model T's are over one hundred years old, been in several accidents, a hundred mechanics have worked on them and what are the odds they all knew what they were doing?" A famous John Regan quote.
The Model T Ford was a good car when new, getting every aspect of one to work like new is a trap for logical people. NOBODY knows everything about Model T's but there many out there who are experts in several areas adn willing to help. Go ask frist.
Ron Patterson

[Allan]

Your 1917 model should have L shaped shackles, not the U shaped variety. There was a nice looking set advertised for sale in the classified a month or two ago, and last post i saw they were still available. They may be a bit later than 1917 though, not having the thread for brass oilers. Last I knew the figure 8 shackles with screw in oilers were available from the vendors if these are correct for 1917.

Allan from down under.

[Erik Johnson]

My unrestored May 1917 roadster has figure-eight shackles with steel oilers all the way around.

My dad's July 1917 touring (last month of the model year) which he purchased unrestored from the original owner in 1949 has "L" shackles all around. L shackles have no provisions for oilers.

The unrestored June 1917 "Rip Van Winkle" touring has L shackles on the front axle and figure-eight shackles with steel oilers on the rear axle.

All three cars above were sold new in Minnesota and all were most likely assembled at the plant in downtown Minneapolis.

[Allan]

Thanks Eric. I thought 1917 was about the time they changed away from the screwed in oilers on the shackles to flip type on the spring and perches, but was not sure of the change in US production cars. It has always made me wonder why the later L type shackles were not reproduced.

Alan from down under.

[LittleTimmy52]

I recently bought the axle book before I bought any of the parts and I'm about to buy the parts but something is throwing me off I think I might have a later production front axle than what I should because according to this book the wishbone should only have the two struts my Model T has four like the later one. Tomorrow when it is brighter outside I'll try to take some clear pictures, I don't want to get the wrong parts.

[TRDxB2]

I recently bought the axle book before I bought any of the parts and I'm about to buy the parts but something is throwing me off I think I might have a later production front axle than what I should because according to this book the wishbone should only have the two struts my Model T has four like the later one. Tomorrow when it is brighter outside I'll try to take some clear pictures, I don't want to get the wrong parts.

Since you said it has four struts I took a closure look at one of the pictures.
One item you have is an anti-rattler this was a "fix" to a worn tie rod bolt and/or yolk. I expect you have one on the other end as well. You shouldn't need it.
The circles indicate rust in the shackle/bushing - so you can expect some issues here.
You have a double wishbone (radius rod) set up. The upper one is stock for a 1917 style perch. The lower one was an aftermarket accessory and worthwhile to keep, as a safety improvement. Later model axles just had a lower one as a design/handling improvement. Take a picture of the end that mounts on the engine pan so it can be identified as an accessory or home made one

[Steve Jelf]

Don't forget the pad on top of the spring.

This one is DIY from a piece of tire.

[Jerry VanOoteghem]

Don't forget the pad on top of the spring.


IMG_0851.JPG
This one is DIY from a piece of tire.

Don't use a pad so thick that the square head of the spring bolt can't reach the hole in the frame cross member. The bolt head needs to fit into that hole to keep the spring located properly.

[LittleTimmy52]

Here are the images. I'm thinking later model front. But what do y'all think?

[Steve Jelf]

Never assume that whatever is on a T when you get it is "correct".
In that last picture the absence of a radiator apron suggests 1923 or earlier.
The spring clip is 1919 or earlier.

[LittleTimmy52]

Never assume that whatever is on a T when you get it is "correct".
In that last picture the absence of a radiator apron suggests 1923 or earlier.
The spring clip is 1919 or earlier.

I have a 17 but the front axle looks like that of the later ones the 19 and later I think, I just want to know if this is the early or late front so I can get the right parts. Also side question how much is an early front axle assembly? Or the parts to correct mine to be more correct for 1917?

[Steve Jelf]

Early and Late are too variable/indistinct to be useful. Is the1920-1927 spring clip early, or late? It's 20-27. Getting the "correct" parts requires some research. Do you have the same 8-5-28 parts book everybody has? It tells you the years of many chassis parts, and has pictures that can help. Do you have a Ford parts book that covers the year of your car? (1917 isn't it?) For identifying parts, the two Gail Rodda books are helpful. Like Sergeant Schultz, I know nothing. Well, I know a little, but some people think I know a lot more than I do because I refer to references. Nobody can know everything, so I believe in having books and other references where I can look for things I may not remember adequately.

How much do the right parts cost? Oh boy. It depends on where you get them. You can buy some good things shockingly cheap at auctions, if you know what an item is and nobody else knows or cares. I bought my set of Boyco running board cans for less than $10 because nobody else knew what they were. I bought two 26-27 Ford gas tanks for $1 because I was the only one to bid on them. I bought a pump jack for $1 because I was the only bidder. You can also spend way too much If you get carried away in a bidding duel. If I see something I want at an auction, I decide on a limit before the bidding even starts.

Swap meets (Hershey, Bakersfield, etc.) can also have prices that are wonderfully cheap, or way too much. Knowing what you're seeing, and how desirable it is, are important factors in preparing to shop.

[TRDxB2]

Never assume that whatever is on a T when you get it is "correct".
In that last picture the absence of a radiator apron suggests 1923 or earlier.
The spring clip is 1919 or earlier.

I have a 17 but the front axle looks like that of the later ones the 19 and later I think, I just want to know if this is the early or late front so I can get the right parts. Also side question how much is an early front axle assembly? Or the parts to correct mine to be more correct for 1917?

Most model T parts are upward/downward compatible. As a result, parts from a later year are often used to replace earlier ones. So.....
"Correct" can be for the year or an acceptable similar part for safety.
Front axle changes by year https://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/F-H.htm#fr1
other references
https://www.mtfca.com/encyclopedia/
https://www.cimorelli.com/mtdl/1917/default.htm


Not sure why your thinking the axle looks like the later other than the spindle is for 1919-25. The rest of the parts look correct. The key part is your 2 hole perch. I wouldn't change the spindles

[Allan]

By 1917 I believe the front axle beam design was largely set. The only discernible differences were the position of the T 202 part number and the forging mark for the different suppliers, neither of which can reliably used to date the axle. Just find the best one you can and work on that.
The bits and pieces to go with it do vary. 1917 should have a chopped leaf spring, L shaped spring shackles, over the axle wish bone and perches to suit, straight spindle arms and spindles without the flats on the inner end. If you want to keep the two wishbones, it may mean you have to use later bent spindle arms.

Hope this helps.
Allan from down under.