Ford Model T generator with distibutor

[Mark Gregush]

Does anyone know about this setup? I just won it on eBay. Not a lot of info in the listing.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/396768409883

[Kevin Pharis]

Interesting find! The mid 20’s Chebby had a dizzy on the back of the genny similar to that. Don’t recall the funny shape dizzy housing tho. Be careful with the drive housing as many are pot metal, so possibly very delicate

[speedytinc]

For the distributor to time correctly there must be some gear reduction built in. There are less teeth on the generator than the crank gear, making the generator turn faster than crank speed.
EZ check. Watch the rotor as you turn the gear. it should turn less than 1 revolution to one revolution of the gear if my math is correct.

You could have something special here or an experiment that didnt work out.

[Mark Gregush]

From the color of the housing for the distributor mount, I am thinking it might be aluminum (hope anyway). Yes, the Chevrolet around 1925 ish did have the distributor driven off the back of the generator and I think other brands did also. Not only were those Chevrolet housings pot metal, so was the body of the distributor. I get the impression that it might be an Atwater-Kent distributor but not sure. Yes, I sure hope the gearing to drive the distributor compensates for the speed the generator is driven at!

[Tom VanMeeteren]

I'd like to see a photo of the points and rotor before I guess what the manufacturer was.

[DanTreace]

This is an early type of such apparatus, was made for the Ford. Seems the very same unit.

Actually like this period item, better to me than a clip on modern front dizzy.

[speedytinc]

Thats it. Quite the score!
That unit would look neat on a speedster.

[Mark Gregush]

Yup would say it is the same thing, thank you Dan.
If you get a chance could you send me a copy of that full page, the bottom is cut off the one in the post. I only have one copy of the Ford Owner and Dealer, May 1926 not shown in it, nore going thru Model T Ford Authentic Accessories (wish those were laid out better, suck for doing research!).
Too add: Looks like they just moved the spark control lever on the shaft up and use the same hole as the carb, how cool is that!

Speedster!

[DanTreace]

Yup would say it is the same thing, thank you Dan.
If you get a chance could you send me a copy of that full page, the bottom is cut off the one in the post.

Here is a scan of the whole page.


click on image to enlarge

Must have not sold too well, as the high price, last Adv. on the unit was Oct 1922 issue, can't find anymore ads for it in the Ford Owner Dealer. And this last ad has the price lowered to $35!

click on image to enlarge

[RajoRacer]

Nice score Mark - & thanks to Dan for locating the original ad ! Hope there are replacement parts available or perhaps a Petronix ?

[Mark Gregush]

I have had one of the Ignitor distributor for years. It was missing the part the cam gear fits onto the camshaft and holds it in place. I will have to go look now and compare caps, but offhand I think it might be smaller.
Dan thank you very much for posting those.
Here is the one I have. The cap looks really good and rotor not too bad, hope they are the same. Someone replaced the points with modern ones. I had made the part that holds the driving gear, which is threaded and still needed a keyway cut and hole for pin to lock on the camshaft but don't know how well I got everything centered, was one of my early lathe projects.

[36mike]

That is a really cool find!! As mentioned above, this was a common arrangement on several makes of the era. 1925 Chevy had this setup plus the oil pump added onto the rear.

Mike

[babychadwick]

Same arrangement on my 29 buick

[Mark Gregush]

Willy's Whippet too!

[baltrusch]

If the generator gear has the same number of teeth as the crankshaft gear, the unit will run at twice camshaft speed. I assume this could provide a wasted spark on each upward exhaust stroke, which should work without any gear reduction. It would be great to see if the unit does have some type of reduction, though.

[Mark Gregush]

Scheduled delivery is Saturday but could be early next week so should know more next week.

[Mark Gregush]

Got it on Saturday. Looks really good inside even the distributor gears had good grease in the housing. The gear on the gen. shaft is 4 tooth and the one on the distributor is 12 so 3:1, with the generator gear being the same count as stock.
I put it on the KRW test stand and out of the box was charging as about 7-8ish amps.
The cap from my other distributor fits as does the rotor. The only difference in the two rotors, the end that sweeps past the terminal is a little wider on one then the other.
Going to remove the brush end cap, give a good clean and figure how the 3rd brush moves and check on the growler, paint and install.

[Mark Gregush]

Well guess it is time for a short update.
While the generator looks good inside and after cleaning/painting put the casting that holds the distributor on and check it for output on my KRW test stand. That part checks out.
The distributor: The cam can be adjusted to any position, like a Model A but instead of using a screw and lock washer it uses 2 ball bearings that are pushed out by a cone on the end of a set screw. (the other one I have used the same idea as the Model A and makes me wonder if Ford bought the pat.) Even after cleaning the cone up some, unless you hold the cam tight it wants to walk around the shaft because the cone is rolling the balls. The pickups for power to the movable and stationary points is a sleeve with spring loaded contacts that ride on insulated plates in the bottom of the distributor body. Then there are two pickups on a spring loaded thing that rode on an insulated sleeve on the main shaft that turned with the shaft and cam no idea at this point how that works but can guess. I rewired the two spring loaded pickups, one to ground for the stationary contact and one to the movable points arm and removed that insulated sleeve.
Got everything lined up and mounted, set the timing, made the advance/retard rod, installed new wires, coil and condenser. Well it ran for a little bit till the cam worked around and went out of time (reset it more then a few times) and think also the movable point arm spring is too weak getting too much bounce.
Pulled the distributor out. This is when I cleaned the cone on the cam setscrew and really looked at the brass gear on the shaft, POOP it is really worn and has a crack running top to bottom.
To save it at this point will need to get a new gear made and am going to modify a Ford Model A distributor to fit. The machined part is just a little smaller in diameter, but the length is pretty close.
Love the coils and all that, but with the coil box mounted on the head like 26/27 no room with the Chevrolet overhead and can't mount on the firewall. For now, see my post in what have you done in July about the Bosch 600 I mounted.